The Digital RVer
Sign up for a feed and get posts automatically.rss

Thursday, July 19, 2007

Wireless on the move


Like many of you, I'm on my annual escapade for the Summer months. Right now, we're in Cape Cod enjoying way too much lobster and clam strips. We're in a campground that advertises "Wi-Fi High Speed Internet Access".

To their credit, they have free access in the store area where you can carry your laptop, or even use a computer they have set up for free Internet access. Nice! However access at the sites is definitely not free. It's a subscription service that charges (like most) $10/day or $30/week, etc. Not really all that bad, but not free.

But I came prepared this time. I have a new Panasonic Toughbook CF-74 with me. To me, this is the perfect camping laptop. Toughbooks are... well, tough. They are shock protected and water/sand tolerant. So if you drop the thing in the sand you can brush it off. I haven't tried taking it to the beach to brave the salt water, and probably won't. But I could!
The Toughbook has built-in WiFi, Bluetooth, and Verizon cellular. When I booted up the first time, the WiFi kicked in and found the hotspot. When I saw that it wanted me to pony-up I switched off the WiFi and let the Verison connection take over. How sweet.
The Verizon EV-DO connection is nearly as fast as a normal WiFi link, and at no extra charge. Of course that doesn't mean it's free. Verizon charges about the same monthly rate for unlimited data connections as Sprint and AT&T; $60.
The only issue with cellular services is knowing which service is active in what location. Unfortunately, there is no global service, yet. To combat that issue, I have added a data plan to my AT&T Blackjack phone that can serve as a modem when connected to a laptop. The monthly charge is about the same as the other services, but with the variety of connections I have, I'm pretty sure I can get connected anywhere that's near an interstate or a town.

posted by Scott at 8:14 AM

30 Comments:

  • Hi: "The perfect laptop . . . and getting online." That's what the article was supposed to be about. So where is the review justifying the assertion that Toshiba is best for RVers? Many laptops are entirely adequate for RV use which is not very demanding. Does the Toshiba have WiFi that works well at long range and better than other laptops? It would be useful to know which laptops work best. My HP has very average WiFi ability but built like a tank. How do laptops compare?
    Secondly, telling us that WiFi in campgrounds isn't always free is something anyone with a laptop will know!. We also know that getting a signal on site isn't usually possible and you have to get close to the office. Few CGs that I've been in have distributed antennas.
    So what would I like to see in a real article about WiFi on the move?
    Do some laptops have better built in WiFi than others.
    Do some PCMCIA cards with antennas offer more sensitivity. Will a $20 card offer greater range for one's weak laptop.
    Any tricks for getting connected to unsecured networks.
    How "illegal" is it to hook into a nearby unsecured network. Tying up bandwidth for hours is one thing while a minute of upload and download is very different in my book.
    I don't mind using unsecured networks for email - who cares if someone reads that "I'm having a lovely time in Myrtle Beach."
    So how about a useful article which includes practicalities rather than an unsupported plug for Toshiba.
    Bye, Donald

    By Blogger DonaldWyllie, at July 28, 2007 4:08 AM  

  • A few comments, primarily for Donald:

    1. Re WIFI - unsecured or secured with PSK - you may think twice about your comment as everyone has access to you email password and potentially all files on your computer.

    2. Using the built-in WIFI in a laptop is a poor choice. You really need an external antenna and a high-powered card that can connect to an external antenna. Check out the YahooGroup internetbywifi..but pay attention to security issues.

    Also, many new laptops no longer use the old PCMCIA standard, so you may want to invest in a USB wifi adapter.

    -Bobs

    By Blogger cookrd1, at July 28, 2007 5:14 AM  

  • Quote: So how about a useful article which includes practicalities rather than an unsupported plug for Toshiba.

    And I thought I was reading about a Panasonic Toughbook!!!

    By Blogger Peter, at July 28, 2007 7:23 AM  

  • We use a Sony Vaio with an AT&T wireless modem card. We have service anywhere our cell phone works. Obviously we get faster service with more signal strength, but usually it is as fast as WI-FI.

    By Blogger griff, at July 28, 2007 7:26 AM  

  • And, lastly, a superfluous comment for Donald: Bobs' laptop is a Panasonic...NOT a Toshiba...

    By Blogger A Pseudonym, at July 28, 2007 7:41 AM  

  • Good article for beginners. As an older road warrior, I distinguish between my "in transit" behaviors and my "destination behaviors." I have had a Verizon aircard for several years. I also have an older and treasured handset that can be tethered to my laptop. Pretty much anyplace you can place a call you caa get a connection albeit slow with Verizon's Quick2Net mobile kits ($35). I wait until after 9 p.m. and burn some free minutes in the fringe areas. The aircard works (new every 2 USB model is now in hand) very well in many places includung home in Wyoming but the vast middle of the country is not so hot yet with Verizon. I have looked at AT&T for its EDGE coverage there but two cell phone carriers with hefty cancellation fees is not a game I like to play. With kids on both coasts for destinations, I picked my carrier by where I spend time. In between times, in transit, I pop for a month or two of Flying J's WiFi hotspots ($20-$25 a month). They are RV friendly, generally have good meals and reasonable fuel costs. Between Flying J and Wal-Mart, my in-transit costs are somewhat contained. My son gave me a clever device by Kensington which is a WiFi "sniffer." Push a button and if there is a hotspot in range, it lights up. I have "piggybacked" on some motel chains that way. Once in awhile I get skunked but not very often. On those occasions I ponder life pre-Internet, and act accordingly. Planning helps but there also is a life beyond the Web. That is why I "go and do."

    By Blogger Stephen's Pictures, at July 28, 2007 7:43 AM  

  • Stephens response is a very good and informative one. He should write a article or just expand the one he has to include more info on all the details of this and that.
    Keep on Traveling.
    Huntoon

    By Blogger huntoon, at July 28, 2007 8:15 AM  

  • I'm not going to be that easy on this subject, these ----- who supply wi-fi and rediculous fees they charge. Excuse me, but there seems to be a underground movement going on to extract as much money from us RVers as can be done. Every time we make a move, someone is there with a new business or opportunity to cash in on RVers.

    Not quiet retired yet, but close, we were never so fortunite to price our products so high and reap such high profits. It is especially aggrivating when there is no sweat equity involved on their part and they squander the proceeds so wastefully. We worked hard for our money and gave every customer a more then fair deal, which allowed us to sleep at night knowing that someone wouldn't be knocking on our door or vandalizing our property.

    I know this reply will send some of you off into a frinzie, if thats the case, then I think you maybe part of the problem, allowing this new generation to take advantage of us and take the fun out of our lives.

    We just came from a resort in Newport where the Wi-Fi daily fee was $3.95, which is outragious. Then to make matters worse their connection was poor and the equipment wasn't working properly, which resulted in no connection at all. What really concerned me was that some of the folks in our rally group who signed on for the service did nothing and allowed these ----- to keep their money for a service not rendered. What folks don't realize is , that this kind of response sets a presidences for others to follow and they think it's OK to do. By now, you know my response.

    Rich

    By Blogger rgamore, at July 28, 2007 9:03 AM  

  • Actually, Donald... You might want to re-read the article. You make some good points, but Toshiba was never mentioned.
    It was a Panasonic Toughbook that was mentioned.

    By Blogger Tom, at July 28, 2007 9:35 AM  

  • I am now 63 years old and have been in my business for over 40 years. I closed the doors to our physical storefront when I discovered that I can continue untethered via modern technology. Now I depend on new technology to continue with our business.

    But for the many who gripe and complain about the inconvenience of costly connections or dropped service, may I humbly remind you that there was a time when we took photographs, waited for days for processing, licked stamps and put them in the mail, waited for replies for days if not weeks AND then never complained if the sale didn't happen. The cost of doing business before today's technology was so far beyond what it is today, both in time and money, that they cannot be compared. Even long distance calls were double, triple and more than what they are today.

    Current technology has changed the face of business, and what comes tomorrow will even surpass what we have today. However, we have become a nation of spoiled whining babies, that have fits if we have to pay for services that didn't exist even 15 years ago. If I can make a day's wage in twenty minutes of my time for $4.00, I count that a treat beyond compare... because those days of accomplishing the same thing at a hundred times the money and a hundred times the time were not that long ago.

    So stop your whining, all of you. Enjoy what you have. If you use the internet to simply tell the grandkids you're having fun, what is it to you (or them) if you have to wait till day's end to find a free connection or spend four bucks to tell them so?

    By Blogger Gayle, at July 28, 2007 10:39 AM  

  • Scott. I really appreciate your article and would encourage you to keep them coming. I found it very informative and appreciate it.

    We use two laptops in our full timing life utilizing a Kyocera wireless router with our Verizon PC Air card installed. When one of our laptops die or out lives its usefulness I will check the Toughbook out.

    I do have a question. You said that you had built in Verizon cellular support in the Toughbook. Is this something that Panasonic has come up with in partnership with Verizon? Is it supposed to be faster than the KPC650 Kyocera Air card that plugs in to a laptop?

    Thanks again for writing the article.

    Jack Clark

    By Blogger Picture Taker, at July 28, 2007 11:21 AM  

  • We take his and hers two top end toshiba laptops that have everything in them and whenever there is wifi within shouting distance we turn them on and they go directly to the strongest wifi signal.
    I find some parks are free, some nearly free and some too expensive to consider and then we get in the toad and hunt a hotspot.
    Life is good to us old timers.
    Bebop

    By Blogger Bill Forrest, at July 28, 2007 11:37 AM  

  • My husband and I both use MacBooks for their ease of use. He was a Windows man for many years, and has transitioned very smoothly.
    Others who fear the change can run in Windows mode with a program called Parallels. We bought it on one MacBook, and have yet to use it.... there's no need...

    MacBooks come with built-in firewalls, and while nothing is impervious to those who want to cause problems, they provide more than adequate security for us.

    Set up on the Mac is instant, and we have wonderful wireless with no trouble. They presently sell with the future 802.11n technology already installed, and our speed is wonderful.

    Our credit union says the best form of identity theft insurance is checking our balances daily or every two days and reporting suspicious activity on our accounts immediately.

    More and more cities are going wireless. If there isn't free wireless at your campground, try libraries and senior centers.

    By Blogger mskathk, at July 28, 2007 11:45 AM  

  • With manners in place, I have had much success simply asking businesses in strip malls or other such places for permission to check my email etc on their network while in their parking lot. Usually a computer shop or phone center, etc. My li'l Spirit is only 21ft so I may drive it more than the big guys n' gals and have less difficulty in getting into smaller parking spaces. Except around hotels or large apts I always ask. I never abuse it and do most of my work offline, only connecting for data transfer.

    Most folks don't seem to secure their services (right or wrong) or even know if it is secure. And I may be wrong, but the air is free (I'm just glad the FCC isn’t regulating oxygen yet). I understand that they (businesses and others) are the ones paying for the service, but they are the ones broadcasting; I'm just receiving their signal and my wireless unit always picks them up eventually.

    The sniffer’s work and they are smaller than opening up my laptop, which does the same thing, although taking longer. I don’t see the necessity of a Toughbook, but an external antenna could be a plus.

    When one really thinks about it, to have to pay for something so universal is silly anyway. Many smaller towns and areas (schools or apartment buildings, etc.) are providing the net for free already. It appears that this may grow even more with demand and support. There are new networks growing and some may want to search for and check these out (and example: www.fon.com ) which cost little or no money. Libraries are free and what is the Internet anyway? Boondockin’ is a different matter, I suppose a booster antenna and cell phone connection would be logical or a balloon with an antenna for a larger shared experience.

    This opened up a good discussion but I would love to see a good article by a techie who can relate to babyboomers with facts and simplicity, comparisons and no singular pitch.

    By Blogger rutaazul, at July 28, 2007 11:46 AM  

  • Thank You... Gayle, Well Said. As someone that has professionally lived the Internet wave for the last 12-yrs. I can say early on I then believed that the Internet would change our lives not unlike "The Wheel", "The Lever" and most certainly "The Printing Press" in Human History, and it has. Today; all too sadly, we have become spoiled little brats when it comes to hi-tech products, programs and services. By Way Of Example: As a investor / founder / President / CEO of a years later 12-yr. old gobally reaching telecommunications corp I jumped into the ISP world and it didn't take very long before $19.95 bought you faster and faster connectivity. However soon we heard... "I have been on your ISP network for a week now and my (((spell-check))) still doesn't work"! At that time I was paying my network engineers around $100 per hr. and yet "WE WERE MADE WRONG" because we attempted to kindly say, "I am sorry, but we are not responsible for your desk top programming issues". Do the above math, after providing only one hour of tech-support per year, per account, we were left with little more than a few dollars; after paying taxes... etc. to actually pay for our re-sold ISP connections. So why I did 2-yrs. ago sell my 984 million dollar per year telecommunication operation ... my profits had dropped so low that it didn't make any sense to keep the doors open anymore. Moreover who would have ever thought that a AT&T would be near a "Junk Bond" level and not a single other telecomm group I personally know of is living in Fat City either. So to the RVer who recently stayed a NewPort, our national telecomm networks are less than a heartbeat away from crashing down around our heads because no one wants to really wants to pay for what their real services cost. As for your; and others, sad IP experience in Newport, did you ever think that problem might be at your end too?

    As for ever using WiFi... If you use it for any personal banking needs, access anything important within any needed secure manner at any time ... I would rather throw the keys to my 1.3 million dollar motor coach into the street down in south east LA knowing that I would not be coming back for a month than to fire up one section on anyone's WiFi HotSpot.

    Think abouit it, currently ID theif is the Crime of the Century... Get it?

    As for IPcell services, as a professional I have tried them all and while Sprint's OFF_SHORE customer service people they blow (Big Time)... however their network is 4-times faster and cannot be touched by all the rest. FYI: There is add-on equipment providers today; Williams Electronic Products is one, that legally boost (both ways) both cell and IP connectivity tower services up to 30-miles now.

    As for the best lap tops, beyond the pretty outside case and cute marketing that says... Yada Yada Yada... there is very little difference to even talk about, however I would add a printer/scanner to the mix if you have room.

    Best of Luck and Happy RVing... David / Lake Oswego, OR

    By Blogger TheBigBuck, at July 28, 2007 12:01 PM  

  • @thebigbuck (David)

    you said:
    "As for ever using WiFi... If you use it for any personal banking needs, access anything important within any needed secure manner at any time ... I would rather throw the keys to my 1.3 million dollar motor coach into the street down in south east LA knowing that I would not be coming back for a month than to fire up one section on anyone's WiFi HotSpot."

    You should actually research a little bit before commenting.

    There is nothing insecure about accessing your banking account with a wifi connection. You are using their SECURE connection - https

    Anytime the URL in your address bar states https:// you are safe, whether you are connected wirelessly or wired.

    By Blogger Debbie, at July 28, 2007 2:15 PM  

  • We've been using our laptop as we've travelled the country, primarily for business use. Our website, www.FunLifestyles.com offers what we term "fun & functional lifestyle 'toys' 4 big kids" and many folks, seeing our ads and product publicity in major RV & boating magazines, said that they wanted to see our portalbe spas, pet strollers, etc. close up and personal. So, for about a year we travelled from our home base in Ashland, OR, doing RV, boating and home shows around the country, and needing to take customer orders and fulfill them using our Laptop (Sony VAIO) at the shows, as well as all over the country.

    We use our AT&T/Cellular (it was a pain transferring from AT&T to Cellular and I now wonder that, with their name change back to the famous AT&T brand, that we'll have to change/update our software again), PC card that has worked incredibly well from some of the most remote spots. Ironically, we couldn't get any signal while doing the Family MotorCoach Assocn's Semi-Annual RV show in Perry, GA. Unfortunately, it's often too slow to download even our emails. Seems that anywhere we can use our celphone, we can use our PC card, and seem to get astroner signal for our data trasfer than we get on voice cel useage.

    When we did the world's biggest RV show, Quartzsite. twice (all who've been there have a big smile on their faces when talking about it), in the middle of the desert, we got a very clear signal.

    Now we serve customers who come to our website primarily and have been doing mainly regional personal, recreational, travel. As we've talked to campground owners, they've told us that their most important upgrades, besides offering full hookups and cable, is WIFI. We've been so impressed by how many campgrounds now offer this service, that we're now considering dropping our costly PC card service. Most of them that we've lately encountered are offering it for free and it's much faster than our PC card/celphone connection.
    Larry Marshall
    marshcons@aol.com

    By Blogger marshcons, at July 28, 2007 3:11 PM  

  • Presently considering purchasing a lap top but am confused with all this wifi, air card, etc. I asked them to stop the world from turning for a couple of weeks - but, nobody listened.Is any one of the laptops any better than the next? Also on the whining complainers, I believe what is objected to is paying fees so some executive can get a ten milliion bonus while the company is in bankruptcy.

    By Blogger Myron, at July 28, 2007 3:46 PM  

  • There are more and more campgrounds that have WiFi. You can keep in touch, check the weather etc.

    We are a weekly reader here, love camping in our HiLo, and are in the business of selling and repairing laptops. We sell the Panasonic Toughbook. It is a good product.

    Our web address is getgogator.com

    By Blogger AOKelm, at July 28, 2007 6:52 PM  

  • This is for Debbie, regarding security on WIFI. You are mistaken if you believe that https on behalf of the website is secure in a WIFI mode of operation. Your data is being transmitted over the 'air' from your computer to a receiving antenna and anyone can intercept the transmission. The only secure over the air transmission is via encryption of data at the sender side and receiver side. Both have to be in sync. Be careful of what you 'transmit' over the air waves.

    By Blogger JohnH, at July 28, 2007 8:52 PM  

  • Thank you for this article. I am just starting out in full time RVing and my little old laptop just died. I dropped it. Dependant on a computer to continue school and business, and pretty illiterate when it comes to wireless tech at all, I appreciate your approach to this subject. Have seen the coast there. It would be great to see it again, this time in an RV so I can stop and enjoy it. Enjoy!

    By Blogger Chappy, at July 28, 2007 9:06 PM  

  • I just came back from barrington nh bought a new acer laptop wireless built in .camp ground had free access right from my site i got on line in 5 min. east coast must be differant mine was free had a great time . oh my acer was only $398.00 from walmart and yes it was a secured site i was on

    By Blogger linda from mass, at July 28, 2007 11:40 PM  

  • Hi again: Toshiba??!! this retirement is relaxing me too much!
    Many comments are very useful and helpful, and some not, and I've learned a lot. The responses suggest that a good article on the subject would be a real service to RVers. There are clearly a number of separate issues.
    Regarding secured versus unsecured. Secured is better but I still wouldn't trust my banking to some "secure" network I know nothing about. Sorry Debbie but WiFi is not as secure as hard wired until some of the encryption issues are sorted out. I am a lot happier than I used to be about online banking but it is still essential to not have any viruses, key loggers on board 'cos the info is sent out unsecured to the thief. There is always greater risk with WiFi so one has to make sure that the firewall and AV programme is working, as well as frequently scanning for key loggers etc. If I'm going to do banking I log in, do banking, log out as fast as possible which may not really help but makes me feel better!
    So, external devices are the way to go and this is something I didn't know. But which ones are best?
    External USB is a good idea and probably a better bet than PCMCIA. But many people have a convenient slot and if we change to a new laptop the $30 for the card is neither here nor there. Any recommendations?
    Stephen makes some good points and I will check out the WiFi sniffer.
    Gayle suggests we stop whining about WiFi in campgrounds. Surely we should expect WiFi to work in a campground that advertises a WiFi connection? I'm sure he doesn't complain about CG water that is virtually undrinkable either! I was in one CG and picked up a motel a mile away on my "insensitive" HP while the advertised CG connection barely worked in the CG office. Yet I was paying a premium for "free internet."
    A final point is that beginners using the internet are most at risk of picking up trojans and key loggers because of their browsing habits. Opening odd sites, not checking urls to see where you really have gone. I.e. checking to see that the address e.g. www.mbna.com is really where you are and are not accidentally at www.iwillrobyoumbna.com. You can have all the security you want but you have to check the urls!
    And so it goes and I don't think anyone has addressed the legality of stealing other peoples network time. And it is theft. I suppose that if you don't run your business by pirating a network and just use a few minutes then it is OK. But I still feel guilty - but not guilty enough not to do it! Asking permission is a novel idea but can anticipate some of the replies!
    Bye, Donald

    By Blogger DonaldWyllie, at July 29, 2007 9:47 AM  

  • I have been using Radio Labs RV II Wi-Fi unit for 4 months and it is powerful. It is a combination wi-fi card and 9inch antenna that plugs into your USB. So whether you are using a desktop or laptop its works. I have been able to pick up wi-fi everywhere I go. It is very pricey at $145.00 but it works great. Here is the web site.
    http://www.radiolabs.com/

    Paul in Sutton, MA

    By Blogger Paul, at July 29, 2007 7:06 PM  

  • There is a way to protect yourself when using wi-fi. You need to use a product the provides a Virtual Personal Network or vpn. You activate this software before you start typing in any of your passwords.

    HotSpotVPN.com was founded specifically to provide VPN service for hotspot users. The charge is $8.88 per month or $88.00 per year. The service uses the common PPTP (Point-to-Point Tunneling Protocol), which is built into VPN software in several versions of Windows, Mac OS X 10.2 and 10.3.

    Security isn't optional at hotspots anymore. As Jeremy Howard, chief executive of e-mail host Fastmail.fm, put it, "You have to assume that anyone can read anything you're typing."

    The web site is http://hotspotvpn.com/

    Paul in Sutton, MA

    By Blogger Paul, at July 29, 2007 7:20 PM  

  • Re: HTTPS

    https is a two sided encryption protocol. It can be (and often is) used over unsecured networks (such as the internet) to support reasonably secure transactions. For more details, I can recommend starting at the wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Https) and digging deeper from there, if needed.

    By Blogger kdbrockman, at July 30, 2007 7:36 AM  

  • We recently began FT after selling our house. Like many, I had hi speed cable at home. Was uncomfortable with the WiFi approach. Decided to go with the Verizon USB plug in so I can move it between our two computers.(we are using our laptop and desk top) I purchased the Verizon USB plug in and decided to add the optional antenna that has 2 suction cups for window applications. Have used it along the east coast between Florida and Maryland. It works great in most areas(compariable to cable). A few places it was slightly slower but acceptible. The cost are: USB w/ software $180 less $50 mail in rebate; the additional antenna and cable about $55. The service for unlimited monthly is $60. Clarify the unlimited to read up to 5G of download per month. It works while traveling the same as your Verizon cell phone.(assuming you have power for your computer) The vast majority of the country is covered but their are a few areas not covered by Verizon. Inquire at a Verizon store for a coverage map to see if most of your traveling areas are covered.
    Happy surfing and be safe!

    Larry

    By Blogger Larry, at July 30, 2007 8:58 PM  

  • John Said:
    "This is for Debbie, regarding security on WIFI. You are mistaken if you believe that https on behalf of the website is secure in a WIFI mode of operation. Your data is being transmitted over the 'air' from your computer to a receiving antenna and anyone can intercept the transmission. The only secure over the air transmission is via encryption of data at the sender side and receiver side. Both have to be in sync. Be careful of what you 'transmit' over the air waves."

    If you are on a https site, any information sent and received is encrypted. It depends on how strong the encryption is, but most banks are using the strongest.

    You are secure!

    Do a search on google for "ssl on open wifi" and you will find lots of info.

    Steve Gibson, from GRC, who is a widely respected security expert has a podcast called "Security Now" - take a listen (or look) and you will learn some amazing things about security.

    I agree that using a VPN to protect you from sending out un-encrypted data is important. I have used HotSpotVPN. It is a good option!

    By Blogger Debbie, at July 31, 2007 3:28 PM  

  • I have used Panasonic laptops at my work and we will never buy them again. Had nothing but trouble with them. The article failed to mention the price of a "rugged" laptop. Most are very prices, upwards of $3000.00.(or more) More than what most normal people would pay for one.

    By Blogger Jerry, at August 5, 2007 6:49 AM  

  • mskathk. I enjoyed your comment about Macbooks. I have often thought about getting one, usually everytime windows coughs up a hairball, but I know very little about them and especially using for wi-fi. I use an IBM laptop with the usual windows stuff and I would be happy to hear any and all, speak up about the Mac's. So if you or anyone else could guide me and give me a little hand, it would be appreciated. I can be reached at desertratdan@yahoo.com

    By Blogger DANNY, at August 8, 2007 4:06 PM  

Post a Comment

<< Home