NEWS & OPINION
A recent post on one of the Facebook pages dedicated to dispersed camping described seeing unoccupied RVs parked for extended periods of time on public land. Some RVers will park on a dispersed campsite and leave their rig there for days, weeks, or months at a time, despite rules on length of stay and unoccupied vehicles. People posting on the Facebook pages generally expressed the belief that this was not proper camping and boondocking etiquette, particularly considering the shortage of campground space in some areas. In any event, it is against long-established rules in most Bureau of Land Management, U.S. Forest Service, U.S. Fish & Wildlife, U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, and state dispersed camping areas.
The BLM pamphlet “Camping on Public Lands” states:
Dispersed camping is permitted in many public lands, with a maximum of 14 days in 28 consecutive days. Consult local offices for specific rules and avoid leaving property unattended for extended periods.
BLM does not define “extended periods,” but with some exceptions, it generally means 14 days on most U.S. federal lands. After the 14 days, most jurisdictions require a move of from 10-25 miles, and some ostensibly prohibit returning to the same location for 28 days. There are also rules addressing camper occupancy of the RV, requiring that an RV is not left unattended for more than 72 hours during the allotted 14-day stay. The rule is widely ignored.
Accessible dispersed camping is limited
Accessible dispersed camping places are limited, even in the vast public lands, and all this is designed and intended to enable more people to camp on and enjoy their public lands.
In the huge Panhandle National Forests, where I do most of my summertime boondocking, I have not witnessed this problem. I believe the reason is that the Coeur d’Alene, Kaniksu, and St. Joe National Forests are so remote—and the roads so bad—that there is little dispersed camping, and the fear of vandalism and theft discourages the practice. On the other hand, the USFS is, like many large public land holdings, understaffed. The rangers are law enforcement officers (LEOs) who are spread thin over their 1.2-million-acre territory.
Good camping etiquette?
RVtravel.com contributor and veteran boondocker Dave Helgeson, writing in RV Life back in 2018, had this to say about the practice of parking unoccupied RVs on public lands:
Is it just me or do others feel that leaving an RV unattended for extended periods of time is abusing the system? After all, our forests belong to everyone. Should they be treated as a private camping club where people are allowed to store their RVs and occupy them only occasionally when they please? It displaces other users that want to camp and enjoy their public land. Plus, who wants to camp in the middle of an RV storage lot?
Mark Spiece responded to a question I posted about this on the Facebook page RV Boondocking:
It’s called Ghost site[s] and it ruins it for those traveling/vacationing looking for those obscure sites ghosted throughout the week by locals for their weekend camping. It’s unethical, illegal, and frowned upon, a site is only occupied not merely by a random tent or a chair or even a camper but when actual humans physically occupy a site. Some people take advantage and tend to ruin it for everyone. These same people would hate it if someone did it to them and left them without a campsite. These lands are for everyone’s use, not just the selfish people. Some people don’t understand anything but consequences; time for significant ticketing costs around $200, tow and impound campers unoccupied for more than seven days, no reason to let ‘em sit there the entire fourteen days unoccupied. Something must be done as this is getting more and more prevalent and more and more abused.
After I remarked that I had not noticed absentee RVers or been aware of the extent of this issue, Colleen Martel said, “It’s actually really easy to tell, and I did this as a volunteer.”
What happens is a notice is put on the RV. Most start with educational flyers that outline the guidelines for 14-day, first 24-hour occupancy rule and 3-day limit for unoccupied RVs and Tents. The notice escalates basically from green educational flyers to a yellow warning, to possibly a ticket from paid staff because after the yellow warning, it becomes the Rangers’ discretion. First and foremost, the focus is on education then it becomes enforcement.
However, enforcement is inconsistent and often difficult for land management personnel to carry out.
The response by the various land management agencies is often a push to close off public lands from dispersed camping. RVers who abuse or ignore reasonable rules contribute to the potential for closures.
##RVT1113b
I know the feeling. I’ve driven by many great sites along a river in my state on a weekday and all I see are trailers. No cars, no trucks. I come back to the same spot next week, same trailers. Forest Service can’t keep up with it all. It’s really annoying. A few folks in a facebook group I’m in have mentioned that they have moved trailers before. I’m not into that, but some harsh penalties should be in order somehow.
Not only is it just plain rude, this is a great way to bring increasing theft into the areas. I live close to a national park, rv theft and other types of theft are on the rise. Leaving your rv unattended is a calling for thieves.
How come the comments section has this all figured out and forest service can’t? Make the fine hurt. If people can afford $20-30k atvs (new cost) then make the fine big. Maybe let forest service and blm know it’s not the ’50’s anymore, there is a lot of usage of dispersed land.
I turned around mtn. biking once when sign said trail closed due to old fire damage. $5k fine AND/or 6 months in jail. That stopped me! I realize that was for my own safety.
Here’s an additional idea. Sell the rv to California, they can call it a homeless shelter. Each rv would save the state tens of thousands of dollars. Actually, would be a low cost to any state for temp or emergency housing.
I guess there are still several people who are more equal than the rest of them. 🙁 Our travels overwhelmingly are east of the Mississippi River (where we live), so the only “boondocking” that we’ve ever done is tailgating at sporting events. This sort of thing can’t happen in those venues because the areas are small and the enforcement personnel numerous.
I see this every summer and the issue is only getting worse with each passing year. It’s absolutely infuriating. It doesn’t seem to matter if the area is a fee are or not, nothing is being done to enforce existing rules or regulations. It’s hard not to be frustrated with the BLM & FS for their lack of enforcement but I also understand they’re tasked with a lot and can’t reasonably achieve everything with the area they’re assigned to oversee.
The county sheriff could make a tidy sum by towing, impounding, then levying massive fines on the owner.
I reported a trailer parked over the pre July 4th weekend to SNRA/Forest Service outside Stanley, ID. They said they would report it to local law enforcement. This behavior is truly selfish. I try not to wish bad things upon others but…
Tag them, tow them, auction them. Pretty freaking simple solution for what is not at epidemic proportions and as such, costs will probably be offset by the auction earnings. Whats that, no value in run down rig? Scrap it for cash.
If someone has a unit of value towed away and auctioned off, she likely won’t abandon another one. Modify behavior, right Cat? I bet the government can get a no fee bid on it with a 3 year contract through the private sector and get them all hauled away for nothing. Pick a region of the country and hire a large repo company that runs in house auctions. Ranger Tags it, marks the GPS location, handled. Send it to repo guy. Next? Here to help.
My take is that if the RV is obviously unoccupied, and multiple notices have been taped to the trailer, then the BLM or whomever should be authorized to tow it, sell it, and pocket the proceeds. No need to worry if you’re in your trailer and staying the prescribed amount of days at the dispersed camping site.
I doubt many of this site’s readers are bogarting spots like this. I wish there was something we could all do to keep those guys from ruining it for everyone else.
I think you’re right–RVtavel readers are probably not the RVers exceeding the limits or flouting the rules. However, I thought it likely that there were a lot of readers who, like me, were unaware of the scope of this issue.
Its a big problem in Arizona, and sometimes really needs to be done.
Enforcement isn’t free. The taxpayers have to cover personnel,equipment and court costs. This can be somewhat offset through use fees to legit users, fines or equipment auctions to illegit users. But rarely is the expense fully recovered. Agencies know this, and take the cheaper course of closing the property to all (taxpayer) users. Don’t like it? Vote for politicians willing to legislate and fund what the taxpayers want.
I think the abusers know the rules and don’t care. Leaving flyers and warnings are a waste of time. Just have them towed, and give a $500 (at least) fine. Public lands often have rules and regulations. Rules are for breaking for many people. Make the rules laws and enforce them. But if our nation’s leaders ignore laws, it must be ok for everyone–and it shows everywhere.
I agree with you. I would further suggest that BLM and Forest Service go to the practice that many states use for abandoned vehicles left on roadways where law enforcement attach a highly sticky notification sticker to the RV and enter the GPS coordinates into a database that is accessible to towing services. Then the towing service would impound and collect the fines and/or sell the RV to offset their costs if the owners failed to pay.
Totally agree. Laws and rules are there for a reason. Violate any of them and there will be consequences. They apply to everyone.
Enforcement is key. Much of our societal problems is from lax or zero enforcement of existing laws.
Ghost camping is already illegal and every RV has a license plate to identify the lawbreaker but there’s no consequences.
I think if a unit sits more than a three days unattended, it should be treated as abandoned and impounded just like a car. (Special exemptions can apply if authorities are properly notified in the case of mechanical failure, health crisis, etc).
If not recovered after a few weeks (abandonment fine, tow and impound fee paid), the RV be auctioned off with the proceeds going toward camp preservation and enforcement.
If the auction recovery value doesn’t cover the fine, tow and impoundment, the registered owner’s tax return be garnished. Give it teeth.
Agree 100%
Camping on federal land should be by permit only, with violators subject to enforcement.
Who is going to enforce this though? The longest consecutive stay I’ve had on BLM land was about 5 days but I’ve never seen any sort of official in that time period.
Exactly, this is not what BLM does. A lifelong friend of mine retired from the BLM after 43 years of service, always said they never had the funding or manpower to do what they felt necessary for range management and conservation. Which includes grazing, mining, coal leases, timberland, fire fighting AND recreation. So enforcement of camping limitations in the middle of nowhere is really an impossible task. Which is really really meant to be on an honor system in the first place.
I read recently where this has happened to an area and the law enforcement towed and impounded the RV’s, mostly trailers and toy haulers. The location escapes me, regardless this is a disgrace to all us law abiding citizens and threatens the experience for the rest of us. STOP IT! Keep our land of the free!
Think about who you’re voting for or against, this is all political and against everything this country stands for.
We can disagree on this one. It’s not politics here, it’s stupidity on individuals abusing the system. This is what’s so nice about this newsletter, keeping politics and religion out of the mix. “IMHO”
Bob, Can we please leave partisan politics out of the discussion. Law breakers are law breakers, regardless of political party affiliation.
Sven, respectfully, Bob didn’t bring “partisan” politics into the discussion as no party affiliation was mentioned. Rather, I believe he was referring to the system in place that governs our national land, which is controlled by politicians.
Yes. And many laws were made before people got so me-me-me.
Oh Bob, it’s about funding. There’s only so much money that BLM receives each year for law enforcement and whatever it is, it’s not enough. Imagine the screaming if your taxes were raised in order to provide more funds to BLM to hire more rangers and tow trucks and people to pick up the garbage. As citizens of this country, we have a responsibility to preserve the land, but some only want to exploit it because they can get away with it. It’s time to get more serious about preserving the land for future generations. Modify behavior.
Tag them, tow them, auction them. Costs are covered, no new taxes. A repo company will probably do it for free and auction them off. They’ll take the good with the bad, even for scrap, maybe make a buck on the contract so a win/win. No cost to the public.
That’ll modify behavior. Lose your precious junk a few times and your behavior will change.
It may be difficult to modify behavior when laws are ignored by law enforcement and courts. I’m not sure how BLM spends the money they have. If I go into a BLM office and employees are in a huddle gossiping, I have to wonder where the money goes. Every government agency seems to have waste. I twice worked for a government agency, the stuff that went on was disgusting.
Hmm. I volunteer with government agencies (NPS, ACOE, USFS) and what I see are hard working and dedicated civil servants who care for the natural resources and do their part to keep this country functioning.