Two weeks ago, we looked at a phenomenon called “phantom” reservations. It’s the practice by some unethical campers of making multiple reservations for the same dates at multiple campgrounds. These campers select one reservation at the last minute, and let the rest go unused. (If you missed that story, here’s the link.)
Judging from the comments on that article, unused campsites are something a lot of campers are encountering this summer.
Let’s look at another possible – and less scurrilous – reason for phantom reservations … the extension of campground reservation booking windows.
Many campground owners, faced with unprecedented demand for campsites, have taken to extending their reservation booking windows to 12 months out and beyond. Extending booking windows was the way many owners dealt with the sudden influx of new guests last summer as campers hunted for ways to get outside after pandemic lockdowns.
Extending booking windows many months out makes sense for campground owners.
Most will charge a deposit. Usually it’s the first night’s fee, but in some cases the entire stay is charged to the camper’s card. Those funds hit the owner’s bank account and become available for the owner to use immediately even though the reservation may be for a stay a full year away.
For campers, the extended booking windows can be the only way to have any chance at camping on popular dates or weekends. They book 12 months out and try to schedule the rest of their lives around those reservation dates.
And that’s where the potential problem of phantom reservations comes up again.
Personally, I couldn’t tell you what my situation will be 12 months from now. Will I still own the same RV, or any RV at all? Will I still be traveling with my pet? What about deaths, graduations, illnesses, births of grandkids and all the other factors that can’t be anticipated a year out?
I can’t imagine the complexity for RVers trying to plan a multi-stop, multiple-month trip a year in advance. They are forced to use multiple reservation sites with varying rules and procedures. They have to keep everything straight and hope against hope that one glitch doesn’t throw the entire plan into chaos.
Keeping to one reservation system doesn’t guarantee simplicity.
The Recreation.gov website, for example, clearly states “The 6-month booking window is not mandated for all locations on Recreation.gov. Some locations release their availability anywhere from 1 month to 12 months in advance.”
What if a camper makes a reservation this August for a camping stay in August 2022, and some life-changing event occurs in the interim? Will they even remember to cancel the reservation?
I’ve recently visited with several campground owners who said they’ve extended their booking calendars because the crowded camping market demands it. They’ve found that if you extend it, they will come (along with their deposits). Some winter parks have even taken to accepting reservations two years out for snowbirds.
I don’t have any extensive studies or hard numbers to support the argument that extended booking calendars result in phantom reservations. To me, it seems like a logical “cause and effect” situation. Maybe, as one reader politely said two weeks ago, the entire phantom reservation issue is a “tempest in a teapot.”
So, readers. What do you think?
##RVT1015
The solution to this problem would seem to me to be disclaimers when reservations are made, no matter how far in advance. Reservation confirmations could state “Failure to arrive or to contact the campground on the scheduled arrival date to inform of an unexpected late arrival shall be considered cancellation of reservation, and any deposit will be forfeited. The reserved campsite will then be considered as available to anyone.”
Retaining a campsite you have no intention of using when a phone call could allow use by another person is as rude as running a generator all night long, blasting music so all camping neighbors can hear it, allowing a smoky campfire to smolder, or keeping “porch lights” on all night long.
I agree to all of that. It appears that there are many inconsiderate people who will make multiple reservations knowing they will only use one of them. They have even commented in this forum that they are proud of scamming the system, as in “tough luck, too bad, so sad”. I believe that the one sure way to fix that kind of behavior is to hit them in the wallet and an earlier comment offered a pretty good approach. Require a fat deposit, at least $100, for each reservation and it’s only refundable under very specific conditions the day of or prior to arrival date. Also, I’m not a big fan of Reserve America, but they could require vehicle specific reservations using make model or tag number. Those could be scanned for duplicates in the same camp on the same days. Find a duplicate? Choose one reservation or game over.
Wow! $100 per reservation! You aren’t making this easy for a real traveler who may go to several campgrounds on a trip. Or, sadly, camping would become elite only unless you are parking on a street or Walmart.
Every year we make our winter snowbird reservations well in advance. The year of the COVID was the only exception when we had to cancel. Tend not to forget them when we put them on the trip planning calendar and flag the reservation confirmation to the trip folder. So far the use of electronic and paper reminders have kept us on track.
Reservations? My recent journey was 4500 miles, I like knowing there is a campsite waiting for me, I fear campgrounds will start overbooking like the Airlines do. I wish campgrounds were profitable enough to have a dozen sites for folks who just show up or charge less for smaller campers.
Because of the difficulty of finding reservations, or just knowing we may not find a place at all if we decide to wing it, we haven’t traveled beyond our home and neighboring states for two years. Even then we can’t always find a campground site. We prefer CoE or state parks because we know what we will get.
Or how about the people who book a campsite for several days before they arrive and just park their car there. I noticed this a lot around State Fair time. They only want to come for the weekend.
A question for the experienced campers. If you get to a campground without a reservation, is there a time of day when they will release the spots for the no-shows, giving you a spot?
No, not usually. Some workamper on here have said that they call at 5pm, no answer and they still are not there by 7 the space is opened up.
Mike, you haven’t accepted the new reality. When you started camping I’m guessing you could start out on a 3 month camping trip without a single reservation and not worry about getting a site each nite. Those days are gone and have been for the 4.5 years I’ve been motor homing. Yes the pandemic seemingly has made it worse but I remember booking sites for my 2 month summer camping trip in Michigan over 4 years ago in April.
You wouldn’t expect an airline or hotel to refund your entire fee if you cancel or no show, so why expect a campground. Yes, as you mentioned life happens and sometimes things change and you may not make that reservation made a year earlier. That’s life.
Now making multiple reservations with little incentive to cancel… well that’s a different issues easily solved by non refundable fees. The same thing you complained about and I addressed above.
However a campground that over books will be a serious issue for me.
Just to note different experiences. We recently spent 3 months (May-July 2021) traveling coast to coast. There were two places we KNEW we would be in advance. In Albuquerque we were meeting a family member flying in so I booked a month ahead when she gave us her flight information. We attended Escapade in Rock Springs WY that was booked when we decided to go many months ahead. The rest of the travel, over 35 stops were booked from no advance to a week ahead as we traveled. Actually a few spots were NFS parks where we just pulled off the road mid afternoon to find a site. Many people are not comfortable with this level of non planning and I understand. We have traveled this way for 20 years.
Generally a well written article but most of it isn’t about phantom reservations. “making multiple reservations for the same dates at multiple campgrounds”
That’s exactly what this is about.
In April 2024, there will be another total solar eclipse that is visible across parts of the U.S. (including my backyard). What I discovered in planning for the 2017 eclipse is that many people who chase eclipses book multiple reservations and make a decision very last minute on where they are staying based on the best weather prospects. I will imagine this will be the case again in 2024. Even though I can watch the eclipse from my backyard, I know that April is severe weather season where I live, so I’m sure I will have a plan B, C, D and E. I’m hoping to make arrangements with people that I know in the path or find some boondocking spots that don’t take reservations so that I don’t have to make reservations for spots that I won’t end up using. My guess is that April next year eclipse chasers will already be making their reservations (some of which will be hotels and not campgrounds).
Phantom Reservations II: Are extended booking windows making it worse? I’m all for making reservations a year in advance especially when you have a group and want to be together. It worked out fine this year and we have already book our camping for this year. Some campgrounds have taken the reservation and have you call back February or March to confirm reservation with a deposit. One campground charged the full camping fee and they explained it was because of the phantom reservations and no one canceling. Others take a one night deposit. So far so good, and if life changes occur we will be contacting those campgrounds to let them know we can’t make it.
If they made the deposits for the full amount of the stay, then that would stop most if not all of this practice.
Agreed. Make the deposit for the full amount of the reservation and make it nonrefundable without a death certificate or doctors note or at the very least a call to the campground the day before. If no call then the spot is opened on the morning of the reservation. There is NO excuse for no phone call, even in cell dead areas you can get to a landline or drive to an area that has reception in the day before. I know of nowhere in the US that you cannot get to a cellphone reception area or a landline in a days drive. Except maybe Alaska.
We are full timers and if we don’t book our year in advance, especially for National & state parks, holidays, winter in Florida etc. we’d be out of luck for a place to stay.
I totally agree.
I’m a planner and often plan out as much as a year. It’s not hard. In fact, there are many places that traveling to requires booking out more than a few months and often 12 months in advance. Take Florida or some east coast places where there are few good and close-in campgrounds such as DC or Boston. Many good campgrounds fill up early with seasonal campers. And yes, things can change, but we budget for that. And, we don’t tend to just camp for the sake of camping, we generally camp in an area where we want to visit specific sites or attractions. Things like location, having electricity, decent wi-fi, pull-thru site (we tow a car) and so on are all important to us. Our travel choices and booking out far in advance ameliorates some of the negatives (bad campgrounds) in traveling. So why not?
As far as making multiple reservations for the same dates, that may happen. I don’t do it and don’t know of anyone who does. Maybe it’s overblown?
Of course the problem with reserving so far out is it commits you to an itinerary. If you find other places you’d like to go, places you’d like to stay longer, you’re out of luck. We’re Elks and almost never have a problem finding space calling the day before or the day of.
As the article pointed out, sometimes life happens. As full timers my husband and I had the whole summer planned and booked. My mom was put in hospice care and we ended up canceling all the reservations. We did lose several deposits but as the old song goes “That’s life”. RVers need to be flexible for life events and weather too.
We noticed – last summer (2020) – on our trip throughout the NW the problem with many, many unused reservations – particularly at National Park CGs. Luckily for us many still had FCFS systems in place for some of the CG (Black Canyon of the Gunnison for example) – or in some cases – even all of it (Gros Ventre in Grand Tetons). Unfortunately this year the trend seems to be that many CGs have gone entirely to reservations only, using the Covid excuse as to their switch (not sure what that has to do with any of it). We do not agree with a 100% reservation system because often those sites are impossible to book – many because of phantom reservations. Still believe that the best system is a to have a mix – reservable sites and FCFS sites as well.
But what we do not understand is why some CGs (some Oregon State Parks!) will not take same day reservations – especially when the entire park is 100% reservation only. It forces one to show up late in the day, hoping for some no shows or
There was one trip I broke down in a remote area far from cell service or land lines. We missed our first night paid reservation for a multiple day stay. Waited for my wife who had the toad find me. It was 11 pm by the time she did. Life happens.
if a reservation fee is going to be forfeited anyway, what is the incentive to cancel? It’s paid for and thus not available.
i was always told from many RVers that if you are self contained you have many options. I found that to be a true statement.
The incentive is being a nice person and letting someone else have a place to camp.
Just completed our 3 month trip east to west and south to north with no reservations and encountered phantom bookings regularly. How hard would it be for reserv.gov to see the same name/info on multiple reservations for the same day at different Parks. Maybe a ban from the system would work.
We have a lot in L. Havasu City and have rented it every Fall and Winter for the last 12 years. Snowbirders are used to reserving spots many moths or years ahead- its always been that way. I guess the rest of the world is now catching on.
Being a long term resident snowbirder at a site is a lot different than the solo traveler needing a place for a night or two or the family wanting to get away for 4 or 5 days. I had neighbors that went to the same campground every year for years. I rarely stay in a campground for more than three or four nights unless it is when visiting my kids in MT and OR. I bought the RV to travel not sit in one place.
It really amazed us that a state campground in Ohio refused to accept a reservation in person when we arrived, requiring all reservations on line. We went to the parking lot and brought up the website, chose the only site facing the lake and returned to the office to register. The sites that were already booked, were booked for several days. We were nearly alone during our stay! Three empty spots on one side, two on the other. Just for grins, I checked those spots daily and they continued to be reserved! It irritated me that interested campers were denied a camping experience because someone felt it fair to reserve spots and never use. Obviously they chose not to cancel.
We have been looking for reservations at NY State Parks and they have a statewide policy of no walk-ins! Reservations only, up to 3:00 pm on day of arrival.
We know of an Indiana family that reserves (phantom) state park campsites then “subleases” the ones they do not use to others. That is clearly a violation in Indiana but they do it often and I suppose they could be making a profit when the end user pays the phantom family for the campsite. What a mess. With the reservation system, you would think that practice could be spotted and stopped.
This is pervasive at public campgrounds because they are relatively inexpensive.
Financial penalties won’t solve the problem.
The penalty needs to be restricted access to the reservation system. First, no multiple bookings for the same or overlapping dates. Second, campgrounds report no-shows and those people are blocked from the system. First offense: 1 month ban. Second offense: 3 months, etc. That will reduce double-booking and incentivize cancellations.
Agreed
Sounds nice. All that will happen is people just use a different email address and credit card to create a new account on Reserve America or Recreation.gov. But it still might help a bit.
It’s worth a try.
I like this. It could still be abused but it would definitely help.
The object of the game for the campgrounds is to stay in business, and if ‘long term’ reservations is the way to go, then that’s what they’ll do. And the ‘phantom campers’ must still pay out for the spots they didn’t use, even though it may not be the entire fee for several days worth of site rent. If gets bad enough & enough complaints made, maybe they should forfeit the ENTIRE costs of their ‘planned’ stay. That would work to trim down a lot of that. Have tried a campground in central GA near daughter’s house for visits & is consistently full & hard to get into. They will only book for 30 days ahead. A few others in the general area will go up to 6 months, so we go there more often with these.
For the campground truly interested in serving their campers, verify registrations by email 2 months out. If check-in time is 4PM, a no-show without a phone call that they are running late forfeits the site at 7PM. That would at least open sites for late, no reservation arrivals.
I Am not a Campground Owner. (40 + years RV’ing, from a tent to 40ft pusher, been to ever state in union) Put your feet in their shoes. What would you do? At this time I don’t know if there is an organized plan within the RV industry addressing this issue?
Develop a plan, if facts change, change the plan, if not makes all look stupid. Meanwhile it is what is, be kind, considerate, understanding, if we can/safely help our fellow man, do so. Especially our 18 wheel drivers – If you think you can drive better than them, go apply !!!!
If one can’t deal with current situation until you/I and RV industry FIX IT. PARK IT!!!!
We worked at a private campground in Utah. If the campers did not arrive by 5 pm or call us to tell us they would be late, we waited until 7 pm and called them. If we could not get ahold of them at that time, we would give away their site. We hated doing it, but how many chances do you need to give them to contact you to tell you they’re not going to show up ??
Perfect!
Reservation Systems like Reserve America should always take “same day reservations” period. I don’t know what Oregon’s excuse is. If campers are not checked in by 7pm wIthout a call in, they should forfeit the night’s fee and open it up to FCFS. If they haven’t arrived by next day check in time, the entire reservation should be charged, No refunds, and opened up to reserve or FCFS. It needs to hurt to be an incentive against the behavior.
I agree. See my comment above
Relative to public campground reservations, I would think that internet programing should be done so camper #676 can only make one reservation per night (date) at any campground anywhere under its system. for example, if one reserves at Yosemite NP for Fri, Sep1 they should not be allowed to also make a reservation for same date at Mammoth Lakes NF.
Even if this camper shows at one campsite , the other campsite is vacant ! If they no show at all – both sites are vacant and not used.!!
There probably, should be much higher penalties for a cancellation or no show and maybe exclusion of those that abuse the system.
I have read both articles and all of the comments and with my experience the biggest problem is with state and local campgrounds. If I am truly interested in staying at a certain place I have no problem paying for the entire stay in advance. If I don’t show that is my problem! Also I book almost solely at private campgrounds and have no problem booking far in advance. If my plans change they usually have a policy if you call ahead of time they will cancel with a small cancellation charge. No problem. I made the reservation in good faith and they in good faith reserved me a site. Phantom reservations seem to be made mostly at low cost and very desirable locations for some people. As some have said pay for the entire reservation up front and forfeit the entire amount if you don’t show up. Problem solved! No need to track who reserves by name or vehicle. Of course this could become a legal problem if no services are provided for the fee.
If you reserve and pay, and you never show up, it should sit empty until ypu do or reservation has ended. If you dont show up, oh well. Its paid for.
Wouldn’t the campground be in a world of hurt if they accept full payments and use the money and the reservations get cancelled…Ok I book one night and you keep it if I don’t show or cancel two days in advance. I book for two weeks, pay in full and cancel a month out and you think you are going to keep that money? See you in small claims court, especially if you rebook that site and get paid for it twice! I think hotels and resorts got in trouble for doing that. Campgrounds should put their cancellation policy beside the reservation form so the buyer is aware without having to go in search of it on the web site. Personally I think campground reservations/cancellations should be just like hotels, I don’t know of a hotel that I can’t cancel before check in time.
If I’m not mistaken, Calif. state parks will hold a reservation for 1 night for a no show to accommodate those who had a problem getting there. If you don’t show by the 2nd night, they release the site. However, if you book a site for 2 weeks and check in on the 1st day, the site is yours for 2 weeks, whether you use it or not.
We have planned our summer trips 6 months to a year in advance since 2018. This year was the first time we have needed to make an adjustment – and it was because of the mud slide that closed I-70 in Colorado. We rearranged two stays and have continued our trip. Campgrounds are busy. We travel to our favorite areas and to new spots each year. I start planning up to a year in advance for some spots and fill in the others over the winter. I usually have all my reservations complete by the first of the year with the exception of those parks with 6 mo. windows. For those, I set reminders on my phone and book my spot as soon as possible when they open for reservations. This year we plan to travel for about four months and over 8,000 miles. So far, the I-70 slide is the only glitch. Don’t remember any issues with 2018, 19, and even 20 (we were lucky). I really don’t understand the objections to planning in advance.
Like several of the posters, I too like to plan my trips months ahead. If you dont book a national park months ahead, you are out of luck. The national park system should be able to require each camper to create a profile with address and vehicle license number. Like Disney is doing now, they could deny reservations for a period after two no shows. Gets more complex for state, local and private campgrounds.
In the New Mexico State Park system, I am routinely seeing the parks at 10-15% capacity. Weekend are much fuller than weekdays, of course, but for me – I am still left in a bind.
On Social Secufity, I must make every dollar stretch, which is why I opted to by a New Mexico State Parks Annual Pass for $225. I am allowed to go to any of New Mexico’s State Parks and camp for no additional fee, except now I have to pay for the Reservation Fee. Many people will only reserve a campsite for the weekend, so since I am typically staying 2 weeks at a time, it is difficult to find spaces available that are available for those 2 weeks straight without being broken up, unless reserved far enough into the future. I can find many spots open for 5 days, then reserved for 2 days, open again for 5 days, and reserved again for 2, ect… many sights are going unoccupied. The reservation fee of $12 is not bad if you only look on the surface. I have already paid for my Annual pass, but now have to pay reserv
Reservation fees as well. 26x$12=$312, so now, all of a sudden that $225 Annual Pass is costing me $537. If I have to make multiple reservations for the same park in tjat 2 weeks, add more tothe cost. If I travell more often than 2 weeks at a time, the cost goes up further.
The whole Reservation System is putting undue hardship on me, and I have brought it to the New Mexico State Parks system Employees and Management, but nothing is being done, until enough people complain, I assume.
It can’t be that difficult to offer a Waiver for Fees to Annual Pas Holders, Elderly, or on an Income Basis.
How would a claim of ‘elderly’ or ‘income level’ be verified online while making a reservation for next summer?
If we assume that many book ahead and simply forget, or “life happens,” then the medical community uses a system that should be easily duplicated in the hospitality industry. I get a heads-up notice a week ahead asking if I still plan on keeping my appointment and giving me a chance to change/cancel. I then get another notice a day or so ahead reminding me of time and date and once again confirming that I plan to be there.
In this technology-oriented world, there are too many “reminder” options (including your own phone, web calendars, et al.) not to use them.
As for those who just don’t care…I don’t think additional $$ consequences matter. It just punishes the rest of us who don’t have the extra $$ to throw away.
Especially in state and federal parks where the camping fees are ridiculously low. People are incentivized to reserve campsites even if they can’t fulfill the reservation. Especially senior citizens you can camp in federal campsites for $10 a night. You can reserve a campsite over a holiday weekend for $30 and then choose to go or not go.
we are still weekend warrior campers taking ours out for a long weekend every month so we don’t go too far & stay mostly in Fl with the rare GA trip. FL state parks are wonderful so we book out 11 months in advance and try to tighten up the reservation as soon as vacation days get approved to free up for others. This keeps us with a rolling fund buried in the reservation system and we will continue to do it this way in order to get into the campgrounds we prefer
I book months in advance for our snowbirding trip each winter. No problem remembering my dates. And keep a calendar of what I booked, and when I can book certain spots 6 months in advance. So if I don’t go or something happens, like last year because of bad weather, I canceled (or they canceled) and found some other arrangements on the fly. If you can’t remember what you booked, that’s on you. Can’t blame the campground.
Remember when? We used to at times load the camper the same day and head to a campground that same day and only once do I remember arriving to a full campground even on a Friday or Saturday night. Those days are gone!
I had a heck of a time booking our 3 month trip for July-Oct back in February. Lots of places sold out or skimpy pickings. But as we are traveling most campgrounds are not full!! This really hurt our ability to be flexible and spontaneous….Campgrounds should charge a booking fee and penalties for cancelling within 2 weeks. Most know 2 weeks out whether they will arrive or not. Those that play with reservations hurt all of us. (kind of like the Toilet Paper “shortage” in the beginning of Covid-19). People horded and created a false void of supply!
Apparently, the financial penalties for “no shows” are not sufficient for the ‘me’ individuals making multiple bookings and then leaving site(s) unoccupied for others to enjoy. I have thought about some solutions that, while not perfect, would serve as deterrents to these selfish practices.
1) Online booking sites can embed algorithms that prevent multiple bookings on the same date(s) by the same person, address, credit card, registration ID etc. While people will likely find work arounds, requiring a photo ID at check to verify you are the registered camper should help discourage bad actors from manipulating the system.
2) Unless a travel emergency arises and you contact the campground on the arrival day for a 24 hour extension, the reservation should be auto-cancelled and the site available to others online via a sign up notification. And in any case, the ‘no show’ should be charged for the full reservation period, not just the 1st night unless the canceled 2 weeks prior.