Dear Dave,
It seems there are few codes or quality standards that are in place within the RV industry. The Recreation Vehicle Industry Association (RVIA) has a few loosely worded codes and the quarterly inspections are a joke. How can that be, and why doesn’t the government step in and regulate quality? —From many RV owners
Dear RV owners,
This question did not come from just one of our readers. Rather, it is a summation of numerous and ongoing questions from my seminars and readers, as well as an article that ripped the RVIA code and inspection process.
For the past few years it has been a hot topic of discussion among RV owners that feel the RVs being pumped out of Elkhart, IN, and other locations are requiring so much work they need to be almost rebuilt.
RVIA codes and inspections
I felt this would be a good opportunity to start a discussion on quality, codes, workmanship, and materials in the RV industry. This post will address the RVIA codes and inspections and what they can and cannot regulate.
After a rather scathing post on RVtravel.com about how the RV industry codes mean basically nothing, manufacturers can just agree to comply, and the inspections are worthless, I contacted Curt Hemmeler, Executive Director of RV Technical Institute (RVTI) and Senior Vice President of RVIA, for clarification of the code and inspection entails.
Curt first directed me to a Press Release that outlined what the RVIA code and inspection process is, which you can read here.
What RVIA inspectors do
In a nutshell, RVIA has a team of professional inspectors that conduct more than 2,000 unannounced inspections at manufacturing facilities throughout the country each year. They walk the line and spot check for more than 500 safety-related standards requirements.
According to the RVIA website, the following standards have been adopted:
NFPA 1192 Standard for RVs (2021 Edition)
• This standard covers the fuel systems and equipment, fire and life safety provisions, plumbing systems, and vehicular requirements.
ANSI A119.5 Park Model RV Standard (2020 Edition)
• This standard covers the fuel systems and equipment, health, fire and life safety provisions, plumbing systems, and construction requirements.
ANSI/RVIA Low Voltage Systems in Conversion and RVs Standard (2020 Edition)
• This standard covers Low-Voltage (LV) electrical systems and devices up to 60 volts nominal or less.
National Electrical Code (NEC) (2023 Edition)
• The NEC is the authoritative document addressing electrical installations in residential, commercial, and industrial settings. The 2023 edition represents a significant revision to modernize the code to reflect the rapidly evolving electrical landscape. [Use to] design, install, and inspect with current requirements for wiring, overcurrent protection, grounding, and equipment.
RVIA codes and inspection is limited
As you can see, the codes and inspection process is limited to materials used and safety issues. It does not cover workmanship or quality as it pertains to processes. Just like residential codes and inspections, there are national, state, and local codes for electrical, plumbing, and other components but not for quality of workmanship.
RVIA standards process
Here is a follow-up that I received from Monica Geraci, Director of Public Relations and Communications of RVIA:
Thank you for reaching out last week to Curt with your questions on the RV Industry Association standards process and how it relates to questions of quality. I know Curt sent you an article we had already written on the standards inspection process, but I wanted to follow up on that with a more detailed explanation of not only the standards process, but the questions on quality.
The issue of product quality and customer service is top of mind in the RV industry, and there is significant attention and investment being given to these important areas. It is important to note that, as in every industry, quality is both a competitive issue and a subjective one – it differs by customer, and it differs by producer – but no industry can afford to understate its importance.
While quality is a subjective issue, safety is not, so we appreciate the opportunity to share more information about our safety inspection process. The RV Industry Association’s standards inspection program is one of the organization’s signature industry initiatives. The Standards Department maintains a professional team of full-time inspectors that promote the enhancement of safety by monitoring RV manufacturer members’ adherence to the standards adopted by the Board of Directors for the construction of RVs.
The team conducts more than 2,000 unannounced inspections of member company RV manufacturing plants annually and is committed to providing educational resources and hands-on training to manufacturer members to support their commitment to comply with these adopted codes and standards. The RV Industry Association’s team of inspectors periodically visit each member manufacturing plant for unannounced inspections. During the visit, inspectors walk every station along the production line, spot checking representative RV units for compliance with over 500 safety-related standards requirements, talking to line employees, and conducting hands-on discussions about these standards.
As a condition of membership, manufacturers pledge in writing that they will build RVs that conform to the NFPA 1192 Standard and Park Model RVs that conform to the ANSI 119.5 Standard. They also agree to comply with regular, unannounced inspections that audit the manufacturer’s compliance with this pledge. Failure to comply may result in association membership being revoked, or the manufacturer being subject to disciplinary action following due process. There is more information about our inspection process here.
Issues related to quality are important ones for RVers, and efforts to enhance product quality and customer service are a major focus throughout the RV industry. Significant attention and investment of both time and resources is being devoted to this effort by manufacturers, suppliers, and dealers alike. Matters of product quality in any industry – not just in RVs – is a key competitiveness issue. Moreover, the very concept of “quality” is – of its very nature – a subjective issue that can and does differ based on the individual expectations and concepts of various customers and producers.
As a national trade association devoted to representing the collective interests of all its members, the RV Industry Association is legally bound by anti-trust obligations to tread delicately with competitiveness matters that impact a collection of competing companies. Nevertheless, our Association encourages all of its members to invest in quality. Such investments improve the consumer experience; and the marketplace rewards those that make those investments.
Monica
Consumers need to get involved
I believe part of the responsibility rests on the consumers to not just shop for price but to demand better quality and workmanship. I have conducted seminars for more than 30 years and I see people getting overwhelmed with sugar-coated “WOW” factor items like full body paint, six slide rooms, and five TVs. But they do not look underneath the cabinets, inside closets, and at components like wiring.
I am amazed at what people will accept in an RV that they would never accept at home. Who has a 2”x2” wood frame in the bedroom surrounded by paneling with a 4’x8’ sheet of plywood and a hunk of foam? Nobody. But try to find a box spring in an RV today and you will not. What you find is a cheap frame made of wood, a hunk of plywood and a mattress—and more than half are simply foam, no innerspring, no pillow-top. After a few nights, new owners wonder why they didn’t look at that. They just assume it has a good mattress and shop on price. If a manufacturer does install a good mattress with innerspring or memory foam or sleep number, it just raised the price $200, $500, or even $3,000 for something most shoppers aren’t even looking for.
Why doesn’t the government regulate the RV industry?
First, keep in mind the RV industry is too diverse and too miniscule when compared to the automobile and truck industry. Then add the roller coaster ride in sales over the past 30 years, with very few RVs being sold in 2008-2010.
Most people today don’t remember when the automobile industry had similar quality issues such as the Ford Pinto that would burst into flames when hit in the back, or the Firestone tires that exploded. Anyone remember the first Toyota cars that came into the U.S. from Japan, such as the Corolla, that were junk? And most people don’t realize it was not the government that created the regulations.
Fortunately, we had Ralph Nader, Consumer Reports, and other sources to force the government to implement crash testing and other regulations as well as to educate the consumer. Ever wonder why there is no Ralph Nader or Consumer Reports in the RV industry? There is no money to be made in it.
The government can only do so much, like set codes and standards for materials but not workmanship or quality. I also believe that if the government were to step in and try to regulate the industry, the cost of the units would be so high only an elite few would be able to afford them. It is no different than some of the low-income housing projects in the U.S.—there are codes and inspections, but the finished product can still be subpar.
You might also enjoy this from Dave
Ranking RV “catastrophes”: Frame flex issues not high on concern list
During one of RVtravel.com’s weekly writers’ Zoom meetings recently, we started discussing the issue of RV frame flex and cracking. Dustin Simpson, contributing writer at RVtravel.com and owner of California RV Specialists, indicated he had at least 30 cases of this in his shop in the last month alone. He mentioned how many RV owners across his Facebook groups (with thousands of members) are discussing this hot topic.
He asked me if I had ever seen anything as “catastrophic” as this issue and, honestly, right off the top of my head I could think of at least 10 other RV issues that I consider much worse.
Dave Solberg is a leading expert in the RV industry and the author of the “RV Handbook.”
Read more from Dave here.
HAVE A QUESTION FOR DAVE?
Send your inquiries to him using the form below.
##RVDT2460
Wow! With no persoal animus intended, Monica Geraci should run for political office. Her “WORD SALAD” was volumuous, yet said nothing. LOL! QUESTION: “How do we fix the problem?” RESPONSE: “Depends on your definition of fix.”
My same thoughts. Her opening statement said it all. Her response is nothing short of “oh well”.
This…
Why doesn’t the government regulate the RV industry?
Because government is NOT the answer. Anyone who believes so is misguided individual who shouldn’t be buying anything let alone an RV. Basic premise in the article is true, if WE the people allow to happen, it will. Set the expectation or walk. And if you do get stuck then get over it and learn the lesson. My .02
I totally agree. We get what we demand. When some independent manufacturers make high quality products, they have to price them at a level that we aren’t willing to pay. This is especially true if you demand high quality and low weight. We are willing to pay the price of junk, so guess what we get?
“We the people allow it to happen…” Is this why America has been a mess since 2016?
And even worse by a factor of 10 since 2020.
since 2009
We can start trying to let others know the problems with RV’s on this newsletter. Readers of this newsletter can also contact their politicians in writing about the RV manufacturers. If we do it enough they will do something. Especially around election time. Finally, don’t buy RV’s that RVTravel readers are having problems with. Maybe even a class action lawsuit will help. Let’s stick together.
Do people seriously think regulating the cheaper product out of the market will suddenly mean they can afford something better?
Airstream once produced exceptional product in a time where there were few codes and even fewer cheap competitors. But not many could afford them.
Winnebago didn’t need codes bureaucratic oversight to be THE name in mass produced motorhomes. They just needed buyers.
Guess what?
Jayco didn’t grow by beating Airstream at quality, they grew by beating them at price.
Thor isn’t displacing Winnebago with quality, they’re beating them with price.
A quick scan of any campsite proves quality is secondary to price.
Quality isn’t only an Airstream vs a Jayco anymore than it is a high-end auto vs a low end one. Trouble free functioning for the intended need can be quality.
A low end stick and tin trailer that functions well can be quality even though it is very basic. If it doesn’t leak, if its components are not breaking constantly and function as intended, then it has quality for what it is. Most RVers don’t need an heirloom build.
If one buys a high-end RV but the unit is constantly breaking down, then it’s low quality.
RVers aren’t complaining because their “Jayco” isn’t an “Airstream” expectation, they are fed up because of constant issues they shouldn’t have regardless.
Couldn’t agree more. Quality is how well something is put together not how much each piece costs or the end price. As we’ve witnessed in the past several years, end price is no guarantee of quality.
Mikal, I hear ya and thanks for the reply.
The point I was trying (and maybe failed) to make is regulation doesn’t create value and quality is not contingent on government oversight. Case in point – Boeing….
My other point is economical pricing typically nets economical value and how the market is creating value decay even on the legacy manufacturers trying to maintain price points where the majority of opportunity exists.
A lot of us (myself included) couldn’t justify owning an RV if manufacturers like Jayco, Forest River and Thor didn’t create more affordable models whose quality isn’t beyond reproach. It can be annoying but it’s not beyond me to fix.
Safe travels!
If you’ve ever toured a mainstream RV factory, you’ll see why they are such junk.
The assembly workers get paid by the piece. They literally “throw” the units together. The first step to quality control is to change the way they are paid.
Bob, I agree. When I toured a high end motorcoach manufacturer, I was amazed when they said the workers were on “pay per unit” wages. At the time (2019) the plant goal was 11 units a day. When 11 were produced, the crew goes home. Hmmmmm…I get all my pay AND get to go home early…incentive??? 🤔
OK, safety is an issue. Our 2024 FR Coachmen Catalina was delivered with sawdust packed into the furnace compartment. The Mobile RV tech discovered it as the reason our furnace kept cutting out and it smelled like burnt wood the first time we operated the furnace. It appeared the clean up person swept all the wood shavings into the furnace cabinet. Coachmen’s “Customer Service” claimed it was a warranty repair issue – no sorry or we’ll give feedback to operations to prevent this in the future. So safety is no more a goal than quality or workmanship – at least for FR Coachmen Catalina
The key to better RVs is up to consumers not government when it comes to quality. I listened to a lot of other owners of and did my own research of the brand I eventually chose and have not regretted. If people don’t take the time to do this and have independent inspections, then it’s on them. Can the government help with safety standards? Yes.
I disagree with the RVIA position that “quality” is subjective. Recognition and appreciation of quality may vary by individual, but quality is there or not.
If the RVIA has so many indepth audits, how does it miss items like no circuit protection, or other highly serious safety items that have been the subject of numerous recent recalls? How many mfgs have been given the boot or a serious penalty?
No, the RVIA is the fox guarding the hen house. Their income is dependent on pushing units out the door with their worthless sticker attached.
Only the consumer can push improved quality and only thru walking past the 5 TVs and paint job to investigate what others are saying.
The idea that govt inspectors will help anything other than the profits for the manufactures is a misplaced pipe dream.
This is 100% a “do your own research” issue and don’t expect to be spoon fed quality by big brother.
Inspectors add costs, costs get marked up = higher profits. I would surmise that the kind of govt oversight this would take in order to be effective would add a 35% – 50% premium price tag to every unit going out the door.
Campgrounds would be less crowded however.
I agree that government isn’t the answer. But I disagree that “only the consumer” can push improved quality.
If a CEO and other company executives have the right training and mindset, they will set quality high on their priority list and create incentives for it. Quality does not result from costly inspections of product after it’s built. Quality is a function of good design, good mfg engineering, the right tools and processes, continuous training programs, supply chain programs focused on vendor quality, and a deep genuine concern for long term client satisfaction.
Great example: Bob Tiffin pre Thor.
Yes Mikal, agreement here. The CEO and mgmt will be driven by lower sales numbers driven by consumer awareness. The mindset on quality will change upward when bonuses change downward.
Bob Tiffin is a great example.
Or, as in Tiffin’s case, a strong quality and customer care mindset by their leader DROVE more sales by extreme customer loyalty, word of mouth selling by clients, lower warranty claim costs, a steadier reliable workforce vs turnover, etc. Note what happened to Tiffin when that ended and how tarnished their reputation has become…that is now the cost of not adhering to Bob’s quality legacy. I have heard that Leigh is trying to restore that. Will have to wait and see.
My point is that this is an area of business where you can have your cake and eat it too! Lack of quality is what costs…real quality pays dividends.
Absolutely correct. It’s one of the reasons I bought a Tiffin. Unfortunately, their product quality has gone downhill. And this started before the Thor buyout. I found issues in my own coach built before the buyout and before Covid. Take a gander and Youtube and the forums now and you’ll see what I mean. They are destroying the family name and it’s sad to see. I will be very selective with our next coach and probably won’t look at Tiffin. I understand that these are for-profit companies but if you build quality and stand behind it, the customers will come with their dollars. I love that social media has exponentially expanded the old “word of mouth.” They can’t escape it.
Why doesn’t the government regulate the RV industry? WHY because of the lobbyist that RVIA & the RV industry pays a lot of money to our legislation so that they don’t regulate the RV industry! Besides do you really want our corrupt government running the RV business? My nickel’s worth.
Snoopy
We all know which party does not like regulations…this why Congress sits on it’s collective derriere and get little done…except lengthy vacations.
So you want RV prices to go higher? You do promise though not to blame greed, right? A chicken in every RV pot? ‘To each according to need, from each according to ability…. ring a bell?
Regulation will drive inflation.
The less they try to fix the less they can break.
Speaking of vacations, 3 weeks on a beach napping does seem a bit excessive. Strong finish JB. LOL.
Yea I hate regulations, like seat belts, air bags, emission controls who needs clean air, or clean water. It was great when a river caught fire
Sorry for the late reply Wallace. I was driving all day, out RVing and such, when it all of a sudden occured to me, I have a seat belt on.
Not sure what seat belts have to do with quality. Rolls Royce has seat belts with but a superior fit and finish. Hyundai has seat belts with less fit and finish. Both have a market. Prevosts have seat belts and Winnebago too. Both have a market.
Cabinets falling off walls have nothing to do seat belts. Leaky roofs are unrelated to clean water and poor plumbing is not a factor of clean air.
Non sequitors, one and all. Do you really want the govt to make Winnebagos cost $2 million? Apples and carrots.
+100 Cancelproof!
Some folks just need a nanny to protect them from bad choices I guess. They just don’t understand that code compliance is a minimum in all construction. Homes built in 1752 didn’t have “code compliance” either and the craftsmanship in many cases, I would argue most cases, was superior to that of 2024, from furniture and finishing to barn construction.
✌️GrumpyVet.
democrats…. You cannot regulate quality. the government only creates outlandish statements that very few people can read. and then they put people in charge who can barely read 8th grade level and do not understand half of what they are to do. then the interpret what they are unable to read and make outlandish demands that have nothing to do with “quality”. I worked as a contractor to government agencies. most do not have a clue and you want them dictating on something they do not uderstand
RVIA, all hat, no cattle.
Hi, Tom. I hadn’t heard of that expression so I looked it up. “All hat and no cattle ain’t gonna get it done.” Trace Adkins, 1999. (I listened to it while I was in there.👍) Learned something new today. Thanks! Have a good afternoon/evening. 😀 –Diane at RVtravel.com
Actually the old saying goes back to the late 1800’s.
Cool. Thanks, J B. When I looked it up I didn’t look any further than Trace Adkins’ song. I should have known, or at least suspected, and searched a little further. Have a great day. 😀 –Diane
Sorry, but an RV that sits in the shop for weeks or months with a manufacturing defect that prevents using it is not a “subjective issue.”
Thank you, Dave! 🙂 I tried reading the follow-up response that you got and, after the first paragraph, I could not continue. It was so much PR, and we care oodles, bushels, and pecks. 🤔😯🙁 I do agree with your concluding comments. Finding an RV that was at least comparativly well-made, if not absolutely well-made, was our goal. We did okay in that regard. DW’s standards were not reached as easily as my own, but we are generally satisfied with RV #2. I guess we’ll see more if next summet’s planned trip to Alaska happens. RV #1 came through its Alaska trip with flying colors. Meanwhile, thanks again, have a great weekend, safe travels, and safe stays! 🙂
This discussion on quality is interesting when you consider the many factors and considerations which go into an Rv – Trailer, Class A, B, C or whatever. We have a super quality Class A Winnebago Vectra 34′ 1994 model! What is the compromise? It severely weight restricted! At 16,500 lbs GVWR and a ton of storage space, the only weight I can carry in the nice large storage compartments – is feathers! Did they use staples, nails or screws? It is all screws in key areas. Is every wire labeled – yes. Did they cut corners? I don’t know where it would be except possibly glue taping the storage compartment door covers. So, more screws and brackets? More weight compromised!
Quality is not a competitive issue or a subjective one. It’s a matter of doing the job right. If it’s not done right someone can get hurt. It takes just as long to do the job right as wrong. The RV industry don’t care and our politicians need too change that. When wiring a RV it should be done to elect code. Service should be upgraded to 50 amp because of the new appliances people use. Equipment needs to be built better. It’s not right to spend Thousands of dollars and sit in dealers lot needing repair. Banks We need to complain to our politicians and pass the word to others on RV’s that are problematic and quit buying them. Now is a good time since RV manufactures are hurting for
We must also inform those who are buying a new RV for the first time the RVIA sticker on new RV’s don’t guarantee Quality.
Standards should be publicly available!!!
“Consumers need to get involved” very simple..stop buying the junk…the supply will take care of itself.