Officials at one state park campground in Colorado are getting serious about dealing with campers who reserve a site and never show up.
Steamboat Lake State Park in Colorado just instituted a new policy aimed at curtailing the number of nightly “no shows” at its campground.
“The park will be implementing the NO SHOW POLICY for camping this coming season,” said a notice on the park’s website. “If you do not show up within 24 hours of your scheduled check-in time, and you do not notify the park that you will be arriving late, your site may be resold and may not be available when you arrive. Any nights passed are non-refundable.”
The move – driven by camper complaints – came after park officials tired of seeing empty sites many nights despite a fully booked campground.
Mark Koep of Campground Views said he isn’t surprised that it was a state park that made the “get tough” announcement regarding no shows.
“Many public parks are still so inexpensive (often $15 to $20 a night) that we’ve seen a lot of campers booking sites and then not even bothering to cancel,” Koep said. “The result is that these public parks often show online as being sold out, and yet there are sites that go unused.”
Koep said he suspects “no shows” have always been a problem at inexpensive public parks that historically had few penalties. “I think it came to a head these past few years as parks filled up and you had to book far in advance to secure a site. People have been booking campsites that they really have had little interest in, just to be safe. Then, they don’t even bother to cancel because it’s only $15 a night lost.”
A new trend?
It’s likely too early to tell if the Colorado park’s move will be duplicated by other state and federal parks. Some parks managers – like those at Steamboat Lake State Park – are given the autonomy to make no-show decisions themselves. Others are governed by policies set at the state or regional level, which involves a lot more bureaucracy in decision making.
Camper response so far is mixed. Koep posted a short video on YouTube about the issue that included two camper comments.
“Hopefully, this will be implemented everywhere,” said one camper. “Something must be done about campsite hogs. Over and over again my husband and I have had to book less-desirable campsites in state or federal parks only to see that the site we wanted goes completely unused for days or even our whole stay.”
But another camper shared a different view.
“I feel that if I pay for a spot – showing up on time or not – it is mine,” the camper said. “I know it is frustrating for others, but I shouldn’t have to worry about telling them I am late. What if the weather has held me back then come in? I think it is just the way it is.”
“Musical chairs” campsites
RVtravel.com reader Susan R. said she’s seen many campers play “musical chairs” at fully reserved but sparsely occupied campgrounds in Utah.
“We just spent five nights at a state park in Utah,” Susan said. “When I booked in January there was only one site left and it was the worst site in the campground but I booked it. During our stay, at least 4-5 of the 10 prime partial hookup sites and another 4-5 of the dry sites were empty every night. There are only 24 sites, so at least a third of the campground was empty each day. However, online the place was 100% booked.”
She said when the campground’s gate officially closed at 10 p.m., tent and van campers in no-hookup sites frantically broke camp and moved to hookup sites to take advantage of electricity. They then moved again back to their original sites in the morning.
“It was like musical chairs and kind of comical,” Susan said. “That was just too much more for us, so we stayed put. “I asked the ranger every morning if I could move sites, but she told me they were all booked. She told more even though no one showed up, the sites were paid for, and they had to hold them.”
Will the policy adopted at Steamboat Lake State Park be just the beginning of similar policies at parks across the country? What do you think?
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##RVT1052b
Colorado State Parks are not that cheap aka for example Cheyene Mtn State Park near Colorado Springs is $41 a for FHU campsite plus a daily per vehicle fee of $9….. We work as camphosts in a Frorest Service campground also in Colorado and our sites are $26 (for dry camping) and $31 (for sites with water and electric, but no dumpstation).
The forest service has the rule that you must occupy within the first 24h. We used to call the no-shows, but people do not answer to phone numbers they do not know! We started texting no-shows the morning after they were supposed to show up. Most people responded to us after we started texting them. We either held the sites for people, that were delayed or we opened the sites up for other campers, when people told us they were not coming. If we did not get any responses our site manager made the call to open sites up or not. It was a bunch of extra work for us, but we had plenty of happy campers.
Thanks for going above and beyond.
that sounds like a fair way. Did you ever end up with two people showing up for same spot? The original and the family who came in late and the newly assigned family? I bet not, it is a gamble but one that will go the parks way.
Kudos to you for going the extra mile. In all 3 of the NFS campgrounds we stayed at last year, at least half the sites were empty due to no-shows. Policies are meaningless unless enforced. Perhaps camp hosts should get extra $ for reporting No shows.
We hate the reservation system. Since it was implemented we haven’t been able to get into our own state parks. Not everyone lives on line.
Making an online reservation is the 21st century. You don’t have to “live online” in order to take advantage of technology. It means no one is being paid to answer a phone and take reservations which means a cheaper stay.
Let’s be honest, it means more revenue since the prices haven’t dropped
As to no-shows, I agree with reselling the spot and the original renters losing all of their fees
I would much rather see each park handle their own reservations. That way they can resell the no show sites directly. If a site is unoccupied by say 5pm with no cancellation then the park can resell the site to walk ups or call ins. It would also eliminate the reservation bots. I would be willing to pay more for this arrangement.
The proper way to handle no shows is the same as hotels. If you do not show up, cancel, or change your reservation by checkout time the day after your arrival date your reservation is cancelled with no refund, and will be resold.
If the parks want to make a strong case to encourage no shows to cancel their reservations, perhaps those that reserve a site and then no show/no cancel be required to pay double the original reservation fee.
Maybe a call / text option the day of the reservation with a reminder to check in before a certain time. And with the call/text an option to confirm your arrival or cancel the reservation. Often times people want that prestine site that you have to book it so far in advance sometimes life gets in the way an you forget to cancel. So I think a text or call system with your reservation would help greatly.
I think the majority of people use smart phones today, they all have calendars, even as computer illiterate as i am I can enter appointments, events, etc. into my phone with reminders about it. So I don’t buy into your excuse as to why people might be to busy to call a cancellation in. The fact is you’re not considerate enough of other people to bother the ME generation.
this should not fall on the campgrounds to call and remind YOU…there are enough complaints seen on this great website about the overworked and over extended staff in the campgrounds. Grow up and sit at the adult table or pay up for your inconsiderate behaviors
If you book a stay of several days and don’t show up, the park system should charge you for the entire stay that you booked if you don’t cancel and THEN also resell the site to someone who will actually show up.
Exactly!
The system should require you to call the campground on your arrival day to say you are on the way.
I agree with the cancellation policy, camping spots on public lands are too precious these days not to be used.
People need to stop treating campgrounds like personal time shares! Just because you paid for it doesn’t mean your morals can dictate not giving a call! If they want sites they don’t have to use because they paid pay for it! get a membership or buy a site on a private campground! Don’t hog the Public parks like they are personal property! How would they feel if someone blocks their driveway just because that leo figures they are not using it yes I have dealt with people like that . They think just because the street is public they can park anywhere they want. The mentality of some people today they think they world revolves around them. When we are going to be late or can’t show up it’s not hard make a 5 minute phone call.
Do you expect courtesy in a discourteous world?
Forget morals. Unless penalties are instituted this situation will not improve.
Just for accuracy’s sake, I’d like to add: The refund policy also comes into play, and hasn’t been brought up at all. There’s a cancellation fee within 14 days of a reservation, and it’s taken out of the refunded amount.
Taking the article’s example, if someone pays $15 for a site, but something comes up and they cancel within two weeks of their stay, they get nailed with a cancellation fee of $6–meaning they only get $9 back. That’s why people won’t bother to cancel–it isn’t that $15 is too cheap to bother, it’s that they don’t even get that whole $15 back if they don’t know the future a whole two weeks ahead of time.
Not totally true. The six dollars is total cancellation charge regardless of how many nights you have booked.
To encourage people to cancel there should be no cancellation fee. However the reservation software should also reject more than one reservation at a park so people don’t reserve multi sites and then cancel all but one the day before.
Problem is they use other family members names.
I think they should put a $200.00 hold on your credit card. No show or no call in, goodbye $200.00 I have also heard people brag about how they reserved several spots at the same time, and when they get to the campground they take the best spot.
Call it a no show fee.
I really like the way you think Rodney!
That’s great, except it penalizes people across the board, including those trying to camp on a tight budget. I want to penalize only the ones who abuse the system. Maybe put in the fine print that that will happen if you no-show.
Who reads the small prints?
Maybe after a gotcha charge for not playing nice, a few more people will pay attention to those details
It’s only a hold, not a charge.
Great idea! There’s no reason not to call/text a cancellation. Make it hurt for the deliberate no shows and bots.
I don’t think the penalty is strong enough. There should be an additional, more costly fine as well. And a ban on future coming at that state park.
I agree. The penalty should be strong enough to discourage no shows.
I like any policies that will allow empty reserved campsites to be freed up. There are way too many reserved sites that are not released. I understand being delayed. Maybe you should get a few get of out jail-free cancels and then you are banned if you keep doing it. Some positive reasons for folks to call in to shorten reservations or cancel. I like the idea of no-shows getting a larger deposit lost for the stay. Maybe your half-price privilege gets eliminated if you no show and do not call to cancel.
No show/no cancel and you can never book in that campground again
Florida state parks require payment in full…..that’d stop ALOT of no shows
So does Texas and many other systems. It does not stop the problem.
It does not stop the problem. Camped at 12 Florida State Parks this past winter. Lots of open sited at every one every night except on the weekends. All fully booked.
I live in Florida near a very popular state park on the Gulf. We have not been able to get reservations or camp at this park for years. Until the advent of Reserve America, you could call and make reservations with the ranger. The ranger would tell you when the reservation was made you had to be at the campground by 5pm or you had to call and say you would be arriving late. Many times we would be at the check in at 5 or 530 and get a great spot. Now when we go to the park for the day we go through the campground before leaving at dusk. Depending on the season as many as 1/2 the spots can be empty.
Occasionally my brother in law, who is IT and works from home, can snag a middle of the week night or two. I dont have time to check hourly or manage waiting lists. So sadly this state park, where we spent many happy days with our girls, is out of reach to the people who pay taxes and live close by. This is really the story for the rest of of the island as well with its huge rental properties that spend most of the time empty. Yet let a hurricane come through and it is my taxes which bale everybody out. This must be how native peoples feel. Florida is dependent on tourism and that is great. However, the state of Florida park system is allowing the hospitality of Floridians to be abused.
👍👏
According to the article, if you are a no show within 24 hours of scheduled check in time, the site will remain empty between check-in time on day one and check-in time on day two to cover the 24 hour no show period. How is it possible for the campground to double dip for the site for that day? If a camper shows up before check-in time on day two, they can still keep their reservation for the rest of their stay paying for the entire booking. This policy may be good for a multi-night stay but for an overnighter passing through, they only forfeit the one night’s fee. Either way the spot is still empty on day one. You will always end up with no show’s that’s the nature of the business. Why are no shows now more of a problem? Is it because of increased COVID related desire for camping or is it a matter of circumstantial greed.
It sounds like a lot of people think they have a Constitutional or god given right to camp.
no, just a desire to enjoy camping . There are too many selfish people who could not be bothered to do the right thing and release a reserved campsite if circumstances change in schedule. Penalties for the lazy and inconsiderate campers should be used to curb this me, me, me. attitude and by the way, phone in if you have to cancel or put down your beer and think of others sometimes.
Big deal, that’s already a standard policy many places. It doesn’t solve the problem, that Friday night is past and gone by the time the ‘penalty’ kicks in. Some current camper who visits the gatehouse may get to move over for Saturday. That doesn’t help the people who had to stay home.
In Ohio State Parks I see about 10% of the sites empty each night at campgrounds that are listed as full. People neither care or can afford to just reserve and not show up.
Ohio sp don’t allow walk ups anymore either, reservations only.
It’s about time! Corp of Engineers need to follow suit also. We’ve stayed in several “full” COE parks the maximum 2 week stay having to move every few days only to see a third of the sites empty the entire time. We saw a couple premium sites sit empty for 2 weeks while we shuffled from one site to another.
And the people who reserve a CoE site, drag their rig on it and then dont show up til Friday night. I’ve seen that multiple times.
That is the ultimate in selfishness.
Paid for or not, it doesn’t get easier than a courtesy phone call to notify you’re going to be late or not show up. Have some decency and allow others to share the RV life.
It isn’t always easy to make a phone call while on the road.
BS.
pull over or put down the beer
State Parks should follow what private commercial RV parks do when it comes to cancelations. They would therefore, create standard that everyone knows and can follow. Everyone, needs to understand what the policies are, just like hotels or other hospitality business, but with spirit of cooperation with RV’rs and then their customers can call or message the park of their status if they want/need to cancel the reservation.
YES! I agree with the policy and hope all State, Federal, parks adopt it. Really, how hard is it to pick up a phone and say you are running late and give an estimate of how soon you will be there?
Quite often it is very difficult, depending on cell coverage. Not all cell plans have 100% coverage.
I say treat them like a thief black list them nationwide publicize name and address make them pay a $500 fine, or the campground could fine them for a no show like $500 make it hefty enough to discourage a no show then use those fines to maintain the campground, definitely need to figure something out, or a non-refundable deposit of $500 for a no show, of course the liars would come up with all kinds of good excuses to get out of paying
Given 24 hours into the reservation to notify they will be late or lose the reservation seems appropriate. It covers those times when you have difficulties leaving your previous site. It happens. I think its fair.
Need to charge for first night.
How about good old respect for your fellow man? The selfishness or lack of respect of some people is undeniable. Perhaps I’m just showing my age but it’s not always about only self.
“Respect for fellow man” Yes but I’m learning that’s not very common anymore. Sadly it’s a me society now.
To those who say that “I feel that if I pay for a spot – showing up on time or not – it is mine,” imagine this conversation at the gas station when you want to fill up…
You: “We want to buy gas.”
Station: “We have lots of gas, but it’s presold to others. We don’t have any for you.”
You: “But, they may not show up for days. Or at all. I need gas now.”
Station: “That’s tough luck. We’d like to sell you the gas, but our policy is to keep it in the tank in case they show up.”
Bang on! A number of years ago, waaaayy before this “no show crisis”, we arrived, without a reservation, at Jekyll Island state park. It was January and we were hoping for a couple of nights accommodation. The woman at the front desk told us that all that they had was their wheelchair site, right next to the washroom. Okay. If that didn’t bother them that we did not require a wheelchair site, we’d take it. As we walked around the park, close to 1/3 of the sites were empty and stayed empty. We inquired about that.
And we were stunned to be told that “we have to keep them available in case Georgia citizens come to camp”. Seriously! Thru the middle of the week, in January, all of those sites empty. Totally ludicrous.
One way to help mitigate the issue – and nobody will be for this – is to raise prices and pay in full up front, There has to be a deterrent to motivate those abusing the system into conformity. But why should we all feel the pain in our pockets to help police the inconsiderate? Forgetaboutit- enjoy your outing, shake out your stress, and arrive back home after your stay with a big smile on your face!
Hooray for Steamboat State Park! This no-show trend has become very concerning in recent years and has helped drive the price of campgrounds higher. Its time to crack down on this practice. I hope this 24-hour no-show policy will take hold everywhere. These inconsiderate campers cannot be allowed to sway our lifestyle.
New ‘no show’ policies will be ‘swaying’ the lifestyle of the “inconsiderate campers”. Is that fair to them? Is your lifestyle more sacred than theirs? It seems to me that there is a ” hooray for me and to heck with you” attitude on both sides of this problem. Like air travel. It isn’t in the Bill of Rights.
The “sides” on this are not equal-equal when one is motivated by selfishness and inconsideration.
I like the policy and think it should be implemented everywhere. Are there circumstances when you are not able to show on time? Of course but I think 24hrs is more than generous. If you can’t call within 24hrs to let the park know why your late but that you’re still coming or that you need to cancel then you probably are just a little bit self-absorbed. If you’re late, whether you call or not, you should forfeit 1 night for sure.
They should be charged for their entire reservation stay. Screw the one night’s penalty. Hit people in their pocketbooks and things WILL change.
The reservation system is broken and needs to be scrapped. The policy of many restaurants is first come—first served and it eliminates the clowns that think reservations are their tool to act with NO regard for anyone else. Eliminating reservations would eliminate the advantages of the rich over the poor in letting the people that show up get to camp instead of being eliminated by someone who reserve multiple sites, which ruins the system for everyone else.
I think this is a policy that should be implemented everywhere. I understand being delayed. It’s happened to me. But how hard is it to pick up a phone and let the park know you are delayed and still coming?
A great policy! There have been too many people who have been reserving sites because they don’t know which week the company they work for is going to allow them to have off. So they reserve all of them and “forget” to cancel the ones they don’t need. I would go one step further: if they don’t call and cancel within the 24 hours, they lose all chance of a refund. Proceeds go to the park.
This is a great way to handle no show/no call situations. It is only common courtesy to call and let someone know that you have been delayed. Wish other parks would institute this policy.
I hope the federal campgrounds take notice. Last year we spent 2 months trying to get 4 nights in Cades Cove in The Great Smokey Mountains .Finally got 3 night booked. Every night there was at least a third of the sites not occupied. This is the American way. A few A$$holes screwing it up for everyone. As far as I concerned if a no show doesn’t notify the campground that they are not gonna make it, they should be fined and banned for the rest of the season. Better yet in a system like reserve America they should be banned from making reservations for a period of time. In this day and age with cellphones there is absolutely no excuse not to notify a campground that you can’t make it.
I’m definitely in favor, and 24 hours is a generous amount of time to call if plans need to change.
It’s about time one of the Parks did this! Not only does it effect people attempting to reserve a site at State Park Campgrounds. It also deprives the Campground from realizing a profit for the site that wasn’t used due to these inconsiderate people. Which enhances the chance of the Parks having to “raise their rates”, to compensate!
The peeps that think it’s their spot because they paid for it, and then don’t show are very inconsiderate people is the reason they do it. This attitude is ruining the camping experience. Same with folks sneaking into an electric site. It’s not theirs! Stop it.
Hotels charge one nights stay minimum for no shows. So should campgounds. Money talks, no shows walk.
No refund for the entire reservation no matter what the reason may be. Well, I guess there is one reason, you’re dead. When their pocketbooks start dwindling due to their inconsiderateness, that will make them change their bad habits and the way they do business.
We LOVE Steamboat and have a very tough time getting in. I like this. The one problem is the HUGE fees charged for canceling. We had a night we were not going to be able to use. It would have cost us that night PLUS a 25 dollar fee to cancel. Does that make sense?
We also stay several times a year at CO state parks, and I didn’t understand the huge fees you mentioned. Here is there official policy:
Would it be easier for all campgrounds to go back to first come first serve basis? Then you go back to risking people saving sites all the time for people.
They should be making a list and checking it twice to see who has been naughty or nice! Seriously though, a database could be used to ID the abusers. Would it be possible to then ban them from the reservation system for a period of time?
I like this suggestion and gets away from basing a policy for all on just a few bad apples.
This new policy is a start, but it doesn’t go far enough. All reservations should require full pre-payment for short stays of less than a week, & one week’s pre-payment for longer stays, to be paid when making the reservation. If the campers do not cancel prior to the morning following their arrival date, they should forfeit all pre-payment monies, or be charged a $75 penalty, whichever is greater. The site should then be made available again. This would put an end to 95% of the non- cancellation trend. There is no reason for campgrounds to tolerate these campsite “hoggers”.
In all parks, there should be sites set aside that can’t be reserved and be on a first come first served basis. That way people just passing through can stop early and still have a chance of getting a site. If I knew there was a chance to stop early and get a site in a poplar campground, I would definitely leave my present site early to arrive at the desired park early enough to stand a chance of settling in for my desired time frame. As it now stands, in Michigan, all the weekends are booked and I could not find any parks I want to visit where I can settle down for two weeks to explore the area. Reservations have sucked the joy I once knew about camping with spontaneous changing of plans because passing through an area we spotted something we would love to see but can’t stop because there are no sites available for miles around.
Exactly. This ruins the fun of traveling. Meanwhile many parks are full up 2-3 days a week, empty 4-5, because travelers can’t stay across weekends.
Internet reservations are both the best and worst things to happen to camping.
So many public parks have instituted a reservations only, no more walk ups. It does take the fun out of traveling.
Totally agree with this, although I think there should be a stiffer financial penalty to encourage people to cancel or at least call that they will have a late arrival
We manage a city park campground.
City policy all reservations paid up front.
Cancellations less than 30 days no refund
Cancellation over 30 days 1 day charge
We have absolutely no problem with no shows
Good plan.
In this day and age of every modern convenience, how hard is it to call. There are always times when you could be late or not able to come at all but the courtesy of a call is not too much to ask. This “all about me” mentality needs to stop. The only language that seems to work is financial. I don’t think everyone should be punished by higher per night prices. But what you could do for no shows and no call people is to charge the full reservation amount AND a penalty equal to triple the reservation amount. So, if your 3 day weekend would have been $75, then your penalty would be $225. Now, your no show 3 day weekend just became $300. On top of that, add a 3 strike rule. If it happens 3 times, then you are banned from the reservation system for the rest of the season and the next season as well. Even inconsiderate and rude people don’t like getting a kick in the wallet!
Not every area has every brand of cell service. Hard to call without it.
Hard to get from one place to another and never have any cell service. Lame excuse, plan ahead.
I hope all state parks adopt this policy. We are volunteer campground hosts at a North Carolina State Park and we see many sites that are reserved but never used. On busy weekends we have had to turn away people that arrived with no reservations and we had used reserved sites but could not let them use them.
Changes need to be made.
I hate it when I show up at campgrounds and half or more of the sites are reserved but empty. I feel that if people don’t show by noon of the second day they lose the rest of the reservation and all their money. I also feel the entire fees should be paid when making the reservation. That is a huge incentive to use the site and yet allow for weather delays and unforeseen issues cropping up.
I hope all State Parks start this. Fontainebleau State Park in Louisiana called me one night when we were running late to see if we were still coming or wanted to cancel. Why can’t the parks call or send out a confirmation text?
They shouldn’t have to call YOU. You should call THEM. It was actually very nice of them to make the call.
Great, but 24 hours is about 20 too many. And if it “bothers” you to call when you’re running late, well, you’re kind of a jerk.
Sometimes there may not be cell service.
No.
Yes. There are dead zones along both the east and west banks of the Kissimmee River. I always warned my Boy Scouts not to bring phones on our MLK weekend backpacking trip for that reason. And every year the newbies would bring their phones and get upset over no service. They just could NOT understand the concept of no cell service. The dead zones are still there, but they’re a lot smaller now.
-Mitzi
“I feel like if I pay for a spot it’s mine” . There you have it ladies and gentlemen. The new American camping ethos.
I would add that that attitude extends well beyond camping these days. However, most of the comments here are in favor of this new policy so I have some hope for our society. We have found that most campers are very friendly and considerate. There are always those that ruin it for the rest of us.
We camphost at a SP and this happens often, even at$41/night. We get inquiries from mad campers looking at the empty ‘booked’ site but we can’t do anything about it.
Typical of any Government entity. This problem should have been solved years ago. Have a driver’s license registered when reserving a site. First time is 100% forgiven. After that a 100 % charge would occur PEROID !
drivers license/ state id AND the license plate to check for duplicate reservations on the same time period. Add a no show penalty that will hurt $$$ and if there is more than 1 episode of no show without an effort to cancel, a no reservation period of 1 year. The license plate of RV would eliminate using another tow vehicle, tent campers would just have the car license
I’m seeing from these comments that more people are in favor of cracking down on “no shows” than not. That’s great and I applaud Steamboat for changing their policy. Perhaps down the road this will be common place, since “no show” policies are a reflection of the times we live in. I don’t see RVing becoming any less popular, at least not in the near term.
I think this new policy is still too lenient. They should forfeit the whole reservation fee AND be banned for a period of time. Now this is for the campground hogs who book multiple sites at the same different places. For those genuinely late…its not that hard to pick up the phone and give a courtesy call. Yes, I know there are times when we are all out of cell service range, but I bet that is far less that the hogs or inconsiderate.
Ironically, the state park at which we volunteer just did the opposite is some: they went from a half reservable, half FC-FS because folks were showing up at 10 am to grab sites! The previous campers had not even checked out…and others had not been cleaned!
Try being a host trying to clean sites and not knowing if the current occupant is preparing to leave or just arrived! Few parks provide hosts with that kind of technology or access.
I do not think they have gone far enough.
They should also add an Extra $100 to the person skipping the reservation for every night missed. In this day and age it is not imaginable to not make a call to move the reservation if you cannot make it. It is called common curtesy.
I agree with this.
It would help if someone in the office would answer the phone. I’ve been trying for a week just to inquire on availability but no one answers the phone nor returns messages or emails. Makes it impossible to cancel if the campground won’t talk to you. Great way to do business!
Exactly the comment I was going to make!
In addition, many state parks do not have a phone number listed that you can call to notify them of a change in plans or delay.
100% for it. Site hogs booking multiple places is stupid & greedy, and when they don’t show they should lose the funds and the spots become available to others for the entire time slots they hogged, be it a day or a week. Seems simple enough to call in if you’re running late, because who travels without an estimation of arrival? Having to book 6 – 12 months out is a pain.
I fully agree! People that live in Florida can’t even camp in Florida because all the camp sites have been booked by people from out of state and some never show up. If we live in the state we should have first pick.
You can book like anybody else.
The issue all stems from self-centered, self-absorbed, inconsiderate people. Make the practice of reserving and then not showing up as inconvenient and financially painful as possible on those people in order to dis-incentivize the practice. That’s when it will stop. When there are no negative repercussions for bad behavior, you simply reinforce that the bad behavior is acceptable. Put sufficient penalties to it, and guess what? It stops. Genius!
The problem seems to be reservations. No reservations, no problem. I still remember the good old days.
Excellent! And it’s about time…
Ohio state parks are online or phone reservation only, you can’t go to any park office to make a reservation period. We have to reserve 6 mths in advance and if you want a spot you better be online or on the phone at 7 am when reservations open or your not getting one. You pay full camping (about $42 a nite for full hook-up) and a reservation fee at time of reservation. If you cancel less than 30 days before the reservation you lose part of site cost plus a cancellation fee. I’m sitting in a state park right now and ⅓ of sites are empty with a sign at gate saying park is fully booked this weekend. I realize that things come up and you can’t make your camping trip you reserved 6 months ago but a third of the park? I don’t think so. Something needs to change.
One of our local COE parks has this policy and I like it.
Yeah, I say bravo to Steamboat Lake. Nothing wrong with this. “Courtesy calls”? When people are booking multiple campsites with no intention of showing up, courtesy was never in field of play.
I absolutely agree something needs to be done. One thing to keep in mind…cancelation fees discourage cancelations. We had to cancel a Montana state park reservation about five years ago due to rv issues. We were refunded $1.00. I’ll still cancel because it is the right thing to do. In this case the penalty for not canceling would be $1.00. Not much of a financial incentive to cancel.
It’s called Common Courtesy. Plain and simple. Showing just a little compassion for one’s fellow humans. Calling to let the park know you’re late or cannot make it at all is a very simple common courtesy. End of story. I support the policy.
We prefer only some reservable sites and the remainder of campgrounds to be on a first come basis and overflow availability.
We reserved a campground then had to change plans and the cancellation charge was more than the reservation fee itself. As another commenter said, this discourages cancellations, so this policy needs to change as well.
Camping because it was so hard to get reservations places so we just travel from Florida to Wisconsin land that we bought
In this day and age contacting a campground that you are delayed is pretty easy. No call= no site.
To me, this is just another example of entitlement, “I feel that if I pay for a spot – showing up on time or not – it is mine,” the camper said. “I know it is frustrating for others, but I shouldn’t have to worry about telling them I am late. What if the weather has held me back then come in? I think it is just the way it is.” There is this wonderful invention called the telephone. My feeling is, use it or lose it (or call ahead). This is the camping I was brought up with and I hate that common courtesy is becoming a thing of the past in our community!
I applaud the CO state parks for the new policy! We will probably not travel by motorhome across country again. . .the problem with getting reservations and having to have a set schedule months in advance has made travel not enjoyable any more. We had similar problems with campsites unoccupied this past year. There must be a way to make people responsible and courteous. We had to leave two campsites early because of weather and we informed the park office so they could rent out those spaces. It was not a big deal to let folks know about our departure.. . .
I feel part of this problem is an issue with the online reservation system. I am disincentivized to ‘do the right thing’ when I will owe another $5 to cancel the reservation I already paid $35 for. I don’t make reservations without full intent to use them. But when my plans must be changed it would be nice to at least allow me to cancel without charging me extra, even if I have to lose what I’ve already paid.
It will increase the income of the campground by being able to get paid twice for the sites. It will help the last minute camper that calls on Saturday morning to see if they have a site for that night. Like the article says, the person that booked the site originally will not be affected, because they had already anticipated paying even if they don’t show up. I think some sort of penalty should be assessed against no shows. Something like if you book in a state park and do not call to cancel when you no show that you are not allowed to book another campsite for 6 months and all upcoming reservations will be canceled and your money refunded minus 1 day for admin fees.
This is a good start but still not enough. Anyone who doesn’t show up and certainly if they don’t notify a park, should not be allowed to ever book at that campground again. And if the reservations are made through a centralized state reservation system, the state should program their system to show if an individual has multiple reservations for the same date(s) and disallow such reservations. And again, the centralized system should note no-shows and not accept any future reservations from that individual including other family members as people will just use other first names so addresses would have to be included. The situation is out of hand and no, if you make a reservation and even if you pay, it’s NOT your campsite until you actually show up and use it.
I worked at a California state park for 5 summers & the 24 hours policy was in place . No matter how long the reservation (2 week maximum) if you didn’t show or call by check in/out time of the next day we sold the site to the next person who could fit in the air. No refund for the unused night & any other refund was handled through Tickertron. While we only had to deal with it on rare occasions & it made the “loser” very angry, we didn’t have shirts sitting unused for more than one night. Our bigger problem was people who came in late at night & occupied any vacant site they saw, not reading the one who reserved it might be arriving shortly after they did. That could get “fun”. Those type problems were quickly turned over to the rangers.
Great idea and one that I hope becomes widely, if not universally, adopted. Do take issue with the extremely selfish, inconsiderate response of the second camper who cannot be bothered to alert the campground of the possibility of being delayed. Such notification, by the way, can go a long way with a campground. For example, we booked a week at a campground on Hatteras Island in the Outer Banks of North Carolina. The campground has a firm “no refunds” policy and is around $90/night. Engine trouble delayed our arrival, so we called to alert the campground. After having the trouble addressed at a Freightliner dealer and losing a day, we continued. Again, engine trouble sidelined us. This time it was clear that we were headed home when/if the problem got fixed. Again we called the campground, explaining that we would not get there at all. The “no refund” campground gave us a full refund (over $800) without us requesting any kind of refund.
Sorry to hear about your engine troubles but good for you for notifying the campground, both times. It pays, in so many ways, to be considerate.
Should have always been charged for no shows.
If I reserve a room at a hotel and don’t show, I get charged for the room anyway.
Most hotels (business travel, not resort vacations) give you a choice of paying in advance for a guaranteed room or you reserve for free but lose it if you don’t show up by 6:00. They also don’t reserve a specific room for you, which gives them the flexibility to shift new arrivals around to vacant rooms. Most campgrounds have you reserve a specific site, which means there often isn’t a single site available for two nights in a row even though the campground is not full.
I can reserve with cancellation privileges, but I pay a higher rate. The key is I have to call to cancel. A no show gets billed.
Guess $15.is chump change to some people, waste not want not
Money obviously isn’t an issue for the no shows and since they didn’t show up losing their spot isn’t a consequence either. I’m thinking if they lost their ability to book a camp site for 6 months they would be more likely to act more responsibly. Include license plate numbers in the reservations so they can’t just book under another name.
With that said, quite a few “entitled” people do show up feeling like they have the right to wander through my campsite, have someone else pick up their trash, put out their fires, ………
This!👆🏼Require vehicle tag and DL# to reserve. A no show that doesn’t call or show up within 24 hrs pays for the entire stay and is blocked for booking at that campground for one to five years.
I like that idea !!
Was a camp host at a state park with all sites booked every night and one of the biggest problems were no shows. People would come in late at night and camp overnight in the no show empty sites and leave in the morning. They were referred as ghost campers. To make matters even worse was the fact that since the state gave free campsites to so many groups of people there was no incentive to call and cancel if something came up.
Simple, pay in advance for what you reserve. I’m doing that nearly everywhere at state parks.
This is VERY common all over the country. It has not put the slightest dent in the problem.
It’s a simple matter of common decency and courtesy. I think the park should make the reserved site available after 24 hours and not offer any refund to the original reservee. I mean what little effort does it take to get on the phone and notify the park that I am going to cancel, or I will be a late arrival. Simple courtesy – to the park AND to other campers!!
As a camphost in one of the busiest park in Az we saw this a lot in the last 2 yrs. It must be nice to have so much money that you don’t care about losing $35.00.
It’s the entitlement generation.
Worst 2 years of camphosting ans we are thinking about getting out of hosting.
Rosalie, thanks for all you do.
from a fellow Arizonan
That’s exactly why we sold our fifth and stopped camping. Everything changed after covid hit and too many inconsiderats hit the road with their new rv’s.
Think it’s a great idea. And we don’t even use state parks. Back in the day when you had to find a pay phone, I could understand not being able to call if you were going to be late. However, with cell phones, what does it take, a couple of minutes, to call and let them know. You might be on the other end of trying to find a site one day & I’m sure you would appreciate this policy. Feel like some people are very selfish. Also, I’ve booked stays longer than we might really stay since we book so far in advance. But as soon as we are sure of our schedule…most times at least a month or more in advance, I will call and cancel the excess days. Most of the time it is only a day or 2.
I certainly hope this policy is adapted everywhere, including COE Parks.
Al campgrounds should be doing this. Common courtesy to call and let the RV park know your plans.
I like it but want to add another twist. If you cancel you get full refund and not the partial refund. This will be an incentive to cancel.
It is about time and hopefully only the beginning. We are full timers and are so frustrated at either not being able to book a site or getting a much less desirable site only to camp for days at a time with the multiple sites showing fully booked only to sit empty. Come on folks either use it (which i prefer) or lose it so someone else can enjoy it.
In 2020, a music festival was canceled in Bend, Oregon. I had paid for a couple of nights in a state campground with a no-refund policy. When I went on-line to cancel the reservations, they wanted to charge a $8 cancellation fee per night….so I just kept the reservations and became “One of those people”. Post-Covid, we have used 100% of our pre-paid reservations.
A no refund policy and a cancellation fee is an oxymoron. Makes no sense. I don’t like cancellation fees either, but getting something back is better than nothing. Can’t say as I blame you in this case…
I can see both sides of this. Still, from the park’s point of view, the site is paid for and therefore booked. The park gets their money and remains in business. If campers have money to throw away, that’s their business. My wife and I have been on the opposite side of this and didn’t camp because we could not find an available place good or bad. It is what it is I guess. I think a disclaimer on the reservation would be fitting and proper. In the absense of a phone call or message, you lose full price on the first day and your reservation on the rest of the days. The park can rent the site out after day one. We will always share our RV activities with inconsiderate people because they’re everywhere. Somethings will never change.
I agree completely in comercial parks – it’s up to them. But in our federal and state parks which are tax payer subsidised this has to be fixed. I get the problem, sites here in NM are $15/night so it can be an insignifigant amount of money to folks…..
It’s a start, but not nearly enough. People who don’t cancel should lose privileges to book in advance system-wide PLUS cancellation of all existing reservations in the system (e.g. Recreation.gov or ReserveAmerica.com). The banning could be for increasing periods (e.g. 1 month, 3 months, 1 year, lifetime). Additionally, frequent cancellation less than 2 weeks before the reservation should also be penalized. A policy like this would be fair and would fix abuse of the system.
I agree there should be a punitive part to not canceling prior normal check-in hours, a phone call, text message, communication of any type to say I have a flat tire, was in an accident etc, I’ll be late but will still pay for my reservation in full. Communication is super easy in this day and age! If no communication, no more reservations for remainder of season and/or following season. I have managed a large church affiliated camp ground of over 750 sites for over 16 years, no shows are unfair to everyone.
The problem is our federal and states have all moved to these systems that don’t have that level of flexibility. I pray they will soon…..
Reservation should be tied to a license plate number. No duplicate or overlapping reservation across the system used.
I also think you should get your money back 7 days prior on a multi-day res and 24-36 hrs prior on a one night stay.
Large penalties for no shows.
All good suggestions.
It’s about time, but the policy described above does not go far enough. We too have seen a number of instances in both State and National Park CGs where many reserved sites were not used.
Here are my suggestions:
1> Remove cancelation fees if a prior reservation canceled prior to Day 1 of original reservation. In other words – allow reasonable cancelations to be made penalty.
2> Since all these reservations are made on-line with a CC, automatically charge a cancelation fee on top of the nightly reservation charge.
3> CGs need to offer a mix of reserved and FCFS sites in order to help other campers find a spot. We have seen a number of CGs go to 100% reserved only – which is the wrong way to go
4> Building on #3 – Offer same day only reservations for open and unclaimed sites. Sort of like FCFS, but with the ability to ensure spots for last minute arrivals.
Most of these fixes require no change in staffing – just a change in the reservation programs.
Re-reading my post – some clarification needed:
1> Allow reasonable cancelations to be made WITHOUT penalty.
2> Automatically charge a NO SHOW penalty on top of CG nightly fee.
3> A 100% reservation policy only encourages no shows and abuse of the reservation system.
.
5> In addition – we have seen some State Park CGs which do not allow same day/same night reservations to be made. Makes no sense at all. Our only choice is to travel all the way to the park to see if there are any open spots. We did that in a FL State park once. They had space (we called) but were not allowed to take a reservation for that same night. We had to show up instead. So we drove all the way there only to find the last spot taken by the trailer in front of us.
6> More CGs need to allow overflow boondocking to FCFS campers. At the same FL beach CG above they had a huge beach parking lot which was totally empty. We would have gladly boondocked there for the night if they allowed us – which they did not
In Minnesota State Parks, If you are lucky enough to find a spot on the day you wish to arrive, you can reserve it with no added reservation fee. We have reserved weekends ahead and decided to stay Sunday and maybe Monday. Went online to the reserve system, found our site was not reserved, and went ahead and reserved on Sunday morning and paid no reserve fee.
I’m frustrated too. I believe a simple computer algorithm could solve this issue.
1. Need DL. License plate. And credit card
2. Site nights paid in full. Not a deposit.
3. No show. No refund. Exception if call to cancel.
4. Algorithm would kick out any duplicate DL, LP or CC so only one reservation could be made.
Problem solved
Problem in places like here in NM is state parks are so cheap that people book/no-sho. They paid for the site, so feel no harm is done when they pay $15/night. There are no checks to see if someone shows up, just marking on the sites if they are reserved or not.
At a state level, we need to start making the problem more obvious to our politicians……
Lately I have had campgrounds call me a day or so ahead to verify I am coming. I assume this is because of no shows. Perhaps this trend will increase and open up some sites
Some campgrounds do charge a fee to canx (NM state parks) in addition to not getting some/all of your reservation fee back. High winds caused us to miss our reservation and when we tried to call to let the park know on the day of no one answered and no phone messages could be left. We encountered the additional canx fee when we tried to cancel online.
Good for the state of Colorado! I approve.
I agree, here in NM we need to figure out the cancelation and make doing so as easy as booking. Reserve America feels like an influence on this issue….
Agree the booking system should not allow double booking. If you can’t make the reservation call the CG and inform them you’ll be a day or two late and hold reservation or cancel all together. It’s called common courtesy. For those who don’t want to be charged to cancel, with the attitude of you’ll show them…you’re not very good at math. Using the example of another reader, if the reservation is $35 and it costs you $8 to cancel that’s $27 back in your pocket. If it a week’s reservation that $237 back in your pocket. The only thing you’re showing anyone is you’re not courteous and not very money smart to be leaving money on the table.
I realize an issue might come up but if you don’t notify the CG of your tardiness or inability to show, in addition to being charged a fee, I’d like them to add “never being able to make a reservation there for life”. People have to stop being inconsiderate to others and suffering a consequence for their actions is a good start..
We have 3 nearby State Parks with low to medium nightly rates and I have been only able to secure a site if I reserve it 3 to 6 months in advance. When we get there, the parks are usually at about 1/3 capacity. IF Louisiana were to take the Colorado approach, I believe it would free up the wasted sites for others willing to book and actually show up. I fully support Colorado’s move.
It would be a good thing for a time limit, if you are not there by 7pm and have not requested a late arrival, your reservations are cancelled with no refund for the full amount. Not just one day, all of it.
I absolutely agree with Colorado’s new policy. It is a simple courtesy to call and say you will be late, or even to cancel. I hope all State parks will do this.
But, then it is incumbent on the system to be able to leave a message, if no one answers. As Ray said, below, he tried to call and cancel, but was not able to leave a message. There is responsibility on both parties to be accessible and accountable.
This is a great point, and the probem needs to be fixed on Reserve America. As always talking about state and federal lands…
If people can’t be bothered to call & cancel, they get what they deserve. It’s common courtesy.
if a camper has not called ahead with approximate arrival time before 5 pm it should be considered a no show and rented to the first come first served:
ABSOLUTELY AGREE. Then when the original reserver shows two days late it will teach a lesson that will spread like wildfire.
We’ve been c/g hosts for state parks – in several different states – and it’s extremely frustrating for ‘walk-ins’ to see sites empty that they can’t take because somebody reserved but never showed. And awkward, to say the least, for us to explain why they can’t use the site. “But it’s been EMPTY the last xxx nights!?!” is hard to refute.
I agree! I wish every park had the same policy.
As long as the system can be manipulated, it WILL happen. Call in because you’re behind schedule is not asking too much. Prices have gone up everywhere I’ve been recently in Calif. and I think failure to call in or show means you forgot hundreds. I’m not likely to play games risking this kind of loss in 💰. Increase the risk and liability and the abuse (for this issue) goes away. Yes, it’s sad to have to take this attitude, but it’s not right to prevent stress from being used over selfish disrespect of those who think ONLY of themselves. Face it, this has been an issue in Ca for as long as I can remember.
No.
I’m put off by the 2nd comment from the article with the ‘why should I have to call’ attitude. Yes, you booked it and it’s “yours”, but if the weather delays you why can’t you just make a simple call? Chances are excellent that you made a call to get the reservation in the first place, how excruciating would it be to make another? This is a prime example of our entitled culture that is rampant in this country. I have a lot more to say about those type of people but I’d rather maintain my privilege to continue to comment on this forum.
Me too
me too
Totally agree!
Touche!
I think the new policy is great. Flat tire, weather, etc. – life happens. You have to deal with it. Late for the gate and the plane is still on the tarmac, – tough. Reservations at a fancy restaurant and your name is called two or three times and you don’t show, they “sell” the table to the next in line. Late or no show to the doctor – you get charged a fee or wait for them to work you in. Just lately our car acted up on the way to a party and we called and told them to start dinner without us and we would be there as soon as we could. What makes RVing so different?
I agree, if they don’t show up on date booked and no call to park, you lose your site.
I think if you don’t show the first night and no call by 8 am the morning of second day, the site and all remaining nights should be opened to first person asking to use.
I had a reservation for one night in RI. Due to mechanical problems I had to cancel. I ended up paying twice, one for the night and another for the cancellation. That really frosted me especially since I’ve been in CG’s where I was told they had ONE site left. Turns out there were many open sites. Reserved I’m sure, but they weren’t there. If I would have known there was a cancellation fee along with losing the reservation, I wouldn’t have called.
Having same issue in British Columbia provincial parks. Campsites are reserved and lots of no shows as they book multiple sites and choose the best one and leave the others empty.
I think part of the problem with online reservations is not printing hard copies and thus forgetting how many multiple reservations have been made; the extra reservations getting lost in a glut of unprinted Emails. That said, if you’re too lazy to track and cancel unused reservations, do us all a favor – sell your RV and take up knitting.
It can be confusing when you are making multiple reservations. As soon as I make a reservation it goes on my online calendar which is what I use to organize my life. LOL
I have not read all the comments, but I agree with all that I have read… I was told by a park ranger that at their location, that they have heard tales of executives handing their secretaries their credit card and a list of locations to reserve for them, and that adds to the sites that go unused, without cancelling… It’s not a lot of money to them!!!
Bingo – state and federal lands needs to managed to the best use by the people.
You owe the camp ground-public or private- the courtesy of a call to account for your lack of being on time for whatever reason. No show at appointed time no spot.
Personally, in private campgournd – it’s up to the owners. State and Federal is where I get concerned as they are subsidized by tax dollars and that needs to be respected.
I think it is a great idea… If you do not have the common courtesy to contact the park, then you should lose your spot..Wake up folks it is time we got back to being a little more friendly to one another….
Fully agree with this policy and many other comments. It actually seems that often the reservation systems are part of the problem – they get their fees and could care less about the camper’s problems! Recently we tried to get a site and the computer system was broke; so called campground and was told I had to go through reservation system! I had been able to select a site but computer wouldn’t complete the payment. Finally got a site and when we got to campground, originally selected site was and remained vacant! This is another reason some sites remain unused! BUT I fully agree that no shows without calling should be “heavy “ penalty!
I agree! Those who think it’s ok to claim a site just because they reserved it (paid or not) are very selfish. If they decide not to go, or decide to arrive later, they should make the adjustments to their reservation.
If we decide to scrub a weekend, I make sure to cancel in the online system or check out with the Ranger and Host. No need in a perfectly good space going to waste.
Thank you!
I believe this is already the policy in state parks in Maine.
Marie, you are correct. Maine has had this policy in place at all state parks for a while, too. https://www.maine.gov/dacf/divisions.shtml
About time! Good policy.
There should be a strong financial penalty for no shows. For instance, if you do not show up for the first night of your reservation, the rest of your reservation will be canceled, you will be charged one night camping and an additional $100 no show fee.
I’ve played the musical sites several times last summer and having to move for one night to another site 2 down in order for someone to come in for one night, then end up moving back to the same site the following day. Same park, saw 4 of us moving around like that swapping sites with each other and then finding 1/3 of the sites vacant. Part of it a lot of parks just self manage where you know your site booked online. They don’t want to do any management of it to look and say I can leave this one here and move this one there. Been in some where never saw a park person the whole time. You generally don’t book a specific hotel room 4 months in advance. Maybe a type room and if changed it’s usually a better room. People go in and just block sites for every weekend through the summer. Something comes up they don’t care. No shows they should keep tabs and when someone does it say 3 or 4 times in a period block them for 90 days or so. Should be easy to program.
One is a start, but will it catch on with others? If not, it’s a useless publicity stunt. As I’ve got kids in school, my only travel options are during the summertime, busiest time for certain, so I try to book as far in advance as the location allows, even then I am rarely able to make a reservation. Tough to compete with those who have all the time they need, don’t care if it costs them a night or two or even have bots that can submit thousands of reservation requests a second. For those who this is applicable, put yourself in my position and see if you enjoy it as much as you do now.
Kudos to the Steamboat Lake State Park Superintendent!!!! It’s sad that so many just don’t care! Unfortunately, we live in an “It’s all about me society” today where there is so much lack of respect to others! I hope this will spread nationwide!
Agree heartily!
I know this is a very small part of the problem, BUT. We travel in a Class B and seldom stay in a spot more than 2 nights. We made reservations for a week a couple years back for a family wedding. We were only in that spot at night to sleep. I suppose that some may have thought that it was an empty site. Twice that week we came home at night and our spot was taken and we had to find an empty spot and get up early to tell the management what we had done. Thankfully we found open spots for the night, otherwise we would have been found in the parking lot in the morning. We may only B a little “B” but please don’t tread on me. Could happen to a “C” as well.
That would be tricky! It has to be so frustrating! I mean, you don’t want to leave items out to get stolen just to look occupied.
I think maybe there should be tags or markers for sites that show occupied – and not for use if the site was never claimed (by those no show reservations).
It is really hard to know the best way for everyone. And whatever it is, should be universal and posted for all to be aware.
Thanks Jewel. One day I left my water hose out to sort of give a hint. It was gone, I guess someone thinking it was just forgotten. Luckily I carry two 25′ hoses so still had one on board. I would hesitate to leave chairs or something like that sitting out. Maybe there are not a lot of “B” owners on this newsletter, BUT there other reasons that an occupied site may not appear to be occupied. That empty site may be a paid, occupied, and used “B” home – hive?. I probably will not be back to my site before the office closes at 5:00. I don’t understand why someone would pull into a site that was not assigned to them. Oh Well….as Frank sang “That’s Life, That’s Life,
It is a problem. At campgrounds where I think that’s an issue (the unattended ones that say ‘go find a site and then give us money on the honor system’), I feel forced to leave a full set of furniture out. Often I will ask the neighbors if they think theft is possible. It lets them know I am coming back, and maybe they will stop an interloper.
Your problem is not the no-show issue, it is campgrounds that can’t be bothered to have a post or list system that holds the site of a motorhome that comes and goes. That’s a separate issue. No public campground should be so disorganized that a camper will grab another’s site.
I realize that this is not a no-show issue, but wished to point out that when one sees “empty” sites, it does not necessarily that it was some inconsiderate no-show person or a screwed up reservation system. I am not defending that at all. I hate the reservations systems (I prefer to call and talk with someone) and have little regard for no-shows. Just pointing out that all “vacant” sites are not empty. My little “B” gets me where I want to go and when. What I posted above is about the only thing that ‘me and my “B”‘ have a campground problem with. Empty may not be vacant – vacant may not be empty. That’s all.
That would be a problem, Kelly, and you were fortunate to find other spots. I wonder if some type of weatherproof notice could be posted to advertise that there is someone staying in that site, but gone for the day/evening?
If I reserve and pay for a site it should be available for my use till the normal Check-Out time at the end of my reservation. If campgrounds want to unilaterally cancel a 1 night reservation then I should get a full refund. What should happen if I reserve a site for 2 nights and pay in advance for both nights, but have a problem on the road and can’t arrive the first night. I show up for night #2 but there is no site available. Things can get real messy as a paid Reservation can be considered a contract. RE campers that decide to move to a reserved but unoccupied site. What happens if the person that paid for the site shows up? Who is going to get the squatters to move? What compensation should I receive if a campground takes my money (not a partial deposit but full price) but there is no site available when I arrive?
You can’t call and say you’re still coming?
I agree Roger – and in the commercial space I agree. However, a lot of folks take advantage of goverment subsidized camping at State and Federal parks. The price is so low that it is easy to just say “screw it” if you book something and don’t make it. Thus depriving other taxpayers of use.
It’s not an easy problem to solve, but should be looked at…..
Excellent idea. Something needs to put in place to address this issue. Hopefully if it is sucessful, Colorado will be proactive and contact their counterparts in each state and report their results. The avg. Citizen is ignored as evidenced by the continued complaints that fall on uncaring, bureaucratic state employess, who do not care.
Many of the public campgrounds we use have long had a policy that the campsite is released if the person who reserved it does not show up by check-out time the next day after the first night. They have just seldom actually re-booked the site.
We almost always reserve. We cancel if plans change. When I’ve run into trouble on the road a few times, I have called, and there has been no problem with them holding my site for me until I could get there.
Reserving a site and letting it go unused, if one has the ability to cancel, is just plain selfish especially in places where campsites are hard to come by. We’ve only done that once in 30+ years,when we didn’t realize we’d made a reservation for the wrong date and it had passed before we figured that out. That was in the early days of online reservations, when it didn’t work as easily as it does now.
Confusing. How do you show up 24 hrs before your check in time when they only let you check in after 1 or 2 pm the day of your Res. I think it needs to be clarified at best.
They mean if you don’t show within 24 hours after your reservation time
another instance of lack of written comprehension !!
I agree with many comments. However, at least in many state parks, there is no one on the phone after 5 pm. In the online reservation system I have used, it is not possible to “alert” the park ranger that you are going to be late. You can cancel (which usually cancels the entire reservation). However, if you just want to free up a spot because you know you can’t make it until a day later, I think that is difficult to do. I think they expect changes to be done at least three days in advance.
It is not always possible to guess exactly how late you might be getting to a campsite. For working people, it is possible to get off to a late start and either arrive very late or else get up early and come in the next morning.
If you don’t arrive by the next day (perhaps before noon and you have not called–remember, the offices are often closed in the evening), then I agree with cancelling your entire reservation.
Good point, Cher. We camp in state parks generally and each state’s reservation site is different. It is effortless to change or cancel your reservation on Washington State Park’s website. However, I recently had to change our reservation through Idaho State Park’s website and that was definitely more difficult and took some work. It would be helpful if every state made sure that their reservation website was as user-friendly as possible.
I am guilty of not showing up for a campsite reservation. I would have canceled my reservation except the cancellation fees and penalties pretty much guaranteed that I would only get a few bucks refunded to me so I blew it off. Make the cancellation fees reasonable and I will cancel my reservation next time.
Fair enough. Cancelling should be quick, easy, and painless.
Unfortunately, you are missing the point. You have deprived someone else of a camping site. Do you need to be financially motivated to make a simple phone call so that someone else may enjoy a campsite? Sad.
Agree with you but it may help some people to do the right thing if we made it more painful NOT to cancel.
It is way past time to institute policies for no-shows. And I believe an additional policy should be instituted: being that most reservation systems are computer based and everything can be tracked, if some books and does not show/no notice, more than 3 times in a year they should be banned from booking for at least a year. With almost everyone having cell phones it is easy to call and cancel a reservation if something comes up – there is almost no real reason for a no-show
make it once a year and I am with you
There should also be a way to prevent overlapping reservations through a computerized reservation system. Just saying.
I remember years ago when we belonged to Coast to Coast if you were not there by a certain time that evening and did not call to say you would be late, you lost your site and it was given to someone parked outside the gate waiting.
As to the guy commenting “ I shouldn’t have to worry about telling them I am late. What if the weather has held me back then come in?” – it is not hard if weather or other things cause you to be late to call. This is called common courtesy – something that seems to be lacking in a lot of people. Of course this also means parks need to make their direct number available vs going through the reservation software.
Reservation systems for other lodging, like hotels, work because the penalty for a no-show is significant; if you know you’re going to be out a hundred dollars or more then you’re more likely going to either show up or cancel. Parks could raise rates to a level where the actual pain the camper would feel due to a no-show might deter more people from making reservations that they never use..but that also restricts camping to only those who can afford it. Maybe a better answer is to either dump the idea of a reservation system altogether and go back to a first-come, first serve policy or make the penalty of a no-show so high that it’s an effective deterrent.
I don’t believe in high rates to camp, but I do believe in high rates for “punishment of problem makers.”
Yes indeed!
Totally agree!
I think the sites should be sold to someone else if the person who booked the site does not show up within 24 hours at the most. If you are going to be late, call. It is a common courtesy!
Common Courtesy! I remember that. I’m 74 years old and I’m afraid I don’t see much of it anymore. Makes me VERY sad.
Unfortunately, so true.
I paid for that site. It’s no one’s business what time I decide to show up. It’s my site for how ever many days I prepaid. The park has received compensation and should NOT be able to sell it out from under me with out my permission.
Said “not a seasoned camper”.
If you don’t show and don’t call, you should lose the site and the fees paid. Selfishness has no place in camping
Agreed. Thank you.
The permission could easily be given within the wording of your reservation. No excuses.
For $15/night sites in State Parks I disagree. Commercial parks – absolutely.
State Parks are funded by fee’s sure, but also by taxpayer money and this I feel this is taking advantage of the taxpayers.
Agree. Commercial parks should have the option to let the no show, no call site sit empty or to resell the reservation and maximize revenue. If a reserver does not like a particular no show policy, they can choose to reserve with another park operator. Supply & demand forces will determine acceptable & equitable policies.
Public campgrounds on the other hand (including concessionaire operated facilities) were established for the community and general benefit of society and no individual should be able to directly or indirectly deny that benefit to other individuals. A campground fee for a public campsite is a USE fee and if the site is not being used, it should be made available to someone who will derive the USE benefit. That is why the COE (and some others) have policies that you must physically occupy your campsite each day. The site is intended to be used and not as an RV storage lot while someone is working or otherwise absent all week.
How sad that we have to legislate common courtesy instead of using common sense and following the ‘Golden Rule”.
☹️☹️☹️☹️ I think you are a me, me, me person! Someone else could enjoy that spot YOU deprived them from!
Found the no-show!
No, you do not have the right to deprive your fellow traveler of a campsite because you booked early and then decide you don’t like the weather that weekend. You are not on the moral high ground here.
How would you or anyone else know the intentions of another camper? Isn’t is a bit presumptuous to believe that someone didn’t show up because they “didn’t like the weather”. There are many reasons for a no show. The campground is under no obligation to inform their guests the intention of others. It would be better for all to just book your sites, enjoy them and stop worrying about the empty ones or the plans of others.
Sad that you are so selfish….
Selfish. Maybe one day you will end up in a horrible campsite while there are more desirable ones that are empty during your entire stay. Maybe that will change your perspective.
As someone who has tried in vain to schedule an extended camping trip throughout a state, 9 months ahead at state parks, I have a real problem with someone who reserves a camping spot and never shows up. Meanwhile, I have had to try to find another park to stay in because the park you and I both desired was full.
mine, mine, mine…This is the same person who will expect the rules of the campground apply to other people because I paid to be here, I can do what I want when I want. Self center egotistical brute. Grow up and join the adult table you toddler
I think campgrounds should go further still, making everyone deposit a 50.00 “failure to show charge”. There is no excuse to force others out because it is too convenient to just ignore their reservation. I have always cancelled reservations I could not keep even when the refund was a pittance.
Very good!
In Minnesota, you must reserve online and pay in full at that time. If you don’t show by checkout time the day after your first reserved night, you lose the spot and your money. If you can’t make it, you must cancel online within a certain time before arrival. You will lose the $7 per site reservation fee and I believe one night’s stay fee. Don’t see many no-shows. It works well. Makes the selfish site-grabbers think twice.
Like!
Exactly, Hotels have no show policies, campgrounds should too.
As a volunteer Camphost for the NPS, I’ve observed the same issues described in the article. While I agree with the view that “I paid for it, I own it”, given the overcrowding in popular parks there should be a provision that the campsite renter acknowledges when they reserve and pay. That provision should have wording like, “IF I do not show up within 24 hours after the designated check-in time (e.g., 3:00PM), I acknowledge that the campsite management may let someone else pay for and use the site that I have reserved. The only exception to this will be if I contact the park and get a verification number that they we will continue to hold the site available for me.” I have seen people reserve group sites @$50+/day and not show up! Money doesn’t mean anything to some people anymore, so something must be done to assist those who do show up – reservation or not.
Like this
I totally agree with this policy in as far as it goes. HOWEVER, note that is a big however, there should be an additional fine of $50.00 and loss of their full rental fees for the other nights. On top of that, no reservation should be taken until 2 weeks prior to the first night. If further explanation is needed, I am willing to give it. I know the problems. I have been a camp host and have lived with these types of problems. If it was up to me, I would slap the problem makers hard.
Love it!
I completely agree with Ed! The cost for no show’ers is minimal and overcrowding via the reservation systems is worsening with more and more RV sales. Under Ed’s system, longer distant travelers, who could not get an advanced reservation, would not necessarily benefit but at least area locals would have an opportunity to use the empty campsite on a last minute basis. Rcreation.gov and Reserve America need to incorporate algorithms to address this problem. I favor increasing financial penalties and reservation blackouts for repeat offenders.
I like that plan. You don’t call within 24 hours after the booked date, you lose it! I saw many spots in COE’s go vacant for days last summer!
I believe it would be easiest and most efficient if all campgrounds (public and private) to only accepted full payment upon reservation and leave any refund requirements in their cancellation policies. If you can’t make it for whatever reason, the site is still yours until the checkout time of your reservation, period. There are many reasons why someone doesn’t or can’t show up, especially last minute. If I book a site for a week and don’t show until day 3, I still have a contract with the campground and they are obliged to rent me the site for the duration of my booking as I have paid for the full reservation. Re-renting a spot without knowing the circumstances for not showing up or showing up late, constitutes a double booking on the part of the campground in which the spot belongs to whoever booked it first regardless if they are late. There will always be scenarios where a site will be unoccupied but paid for none the less.
Why couldn’t you just call and cancel day 1 & 2? Sorry, but I completely disagree with you. I am guessing that unless you are stranded in the wilderness with NO cell service, at some point on day 1 or 2 you could let the campground know that you are going to be late.
In my opinion, this is selfish. If you’ve reserved a space for a week and can’t make it just cancel. If you believe that just because you paid for it it is yours whether you show up of not that is just plain selfish. Others who would love to have that space suffer. I wonder what you would think if you were on the receiving end of this – say you were camped in a less desirable space and another nice space on waterfront, etc. was empty the entire time you were there. Wouldn’t that make you just a little bit angry. Think about some else other than yourself!
If you have a “contract” with the campground and they are obligated to hold the site for you then you are just as obligated to show up for your reserved site as scheduled. Think about others as well as yourself.
Is it really that hard to notify the campground of your change in plans? If you book Friday to Friday and it appears you won’t be able to get there until Monday, freeing up that site would be the decent thing to do. By calling you can preserve the days you do plan to be there while giving another camper an opportunity to have a nice few days using the site. The cost of the site may not mean much to you but it may make all the difference in the world to someone else. Consideration and empathy could go a long way to making travel and camping more enjoyable for all of us.
Because of people with your sense of me-me-me entitlement. it is almost impossible for people like me to even get a campsite in my own state.
I would like to thank Chris, Mary, Emmy and Kitty for their replies. I consider myself in no way selfish nor entitled but simply providing a realistic scenario, if (as my first sentence states) that anyone who has paid, in full, for their reservation. In today’s campground world we all know that reservation cancellations of less than a week usually result in little of no refund at all. I’m sorry if you take offence but if I have paid for a spot a head of time, especially for several days, and can’t make it, last minute, until the next day or so I still expect the spot, again that I have paid for, to be available. I always try to give the campground notice if I will be late, but some campgrounds, especially public ones there is no one to speak with after 4pm. To change a week-long booking to let’s say, the last 5 nights, “at the last minute”, will usually result in no refunds for those missed nights plus additional cancellation/change fees for the remainder. I have read many articles in the campground overcrowding section of this news-letter and a lot of folks call for “payment in full” to help solve booking no-shows. No shows are still going to happen and if I have pre-paid in full and don’t cancel I will be out the full payment. Either way, the spot will be empty. Sorry for any inconvenience but I understand that if a site is booked, it’s booked and someone else beat me to the reservation.
I worked at a National Forest Park and saw the same thing. I am with the Colorado State Park new rule. It was commented lots of times that people will reserve then once they arrive to the area look for a spot that has full hook ups. If so just ignore the reservation they made originally.
We saw something similar in the Canadian National Parks last summer. It doesn’t make sense. Allow someone to book a place and it’s only cancelled after the first night has long gone? It still means an empty site overnight.
Much better to say, if you haven’t shown up by 9pm, your site will be gone unless you give advanced notice of a later arrival.
Either that or put their name and credit card details on a no-booking list. Prevent them booking a site in future. Do that a few times and people would soon change their behaviour.
I support the park. Selfishness abounds. The people who claim “I paid for it. It’s mine.” but don’t show up are depriving others of the site’s use. They should lose the site and at least a penalty large enough that they’ll stop booking sites and not cancelling them. However, if they do get hung up and must arrive late, they should call ahead and be able to keep the site. It’s really not that hard to make this work for everyone.
Agree with everything you said. We need to think of others when we are enjoying the beautiful outdoors.
I am astonished at some of the responses here about people saying that if they have paid for the site it should remain theirs whether they show up or not. So selfish. Wow, just wow. Come on people, get a clue!
I wholeheartedly agree with this policy and I hope that other public campgrounds throughout the country strengthen their policies too. We have had that experience where we booked months ahead in a state park, taking the last spot available which also happened to be the least desirable spot. We watched all week long as better sites sat vacant for the length of our visit. It was pretty frustrating.
State parks’ reservation processes should be reviewed and revised to avoid such confusion. Our park only allows chartered clubs/groups such as Good Sams, Elks, et al to reserve more than one RV site; however, individuals must engage us separately. We do not require credit cards nor payment in advance and cancellations must be emailed or called in by 1:00 PM the day prior to the expected arrival. We call and/or email one week prior to arrival to confirm each camper’s intentions. Campers must let us know if they will arrive after the office closes at 5:00 PM in order to gain access to the park. Our policy is that a reservation will be cancelled for “No Show-No Call” after 1:00 PM check-in.
Agreed. If a camper has booked a multi-night stay and can’t make the first night or two but has let the campground know they will be late the reservation should remain intact, for the duration of the stay. The campground has no obligation to inform any campers of the arrival/departure status of their guest. There are lots of reasons a camper may be a no show for a night or two and some folks will still find ways to complain about empty spots in the campground.
It’s hard to understand the issue with the longer term booking as most of the reservations that I have made are only good if you arrive in the first day – they only charge you one night if you don’t show up.
And as for the “camper with the other view”, it sounds like he doesn’t care about anyone but himself with his failure to notify the park that they would be late.
Common courtesy should prevail but the “Covid Campers” have yet to understand that seasoned campers do look out for each other. Yes, things happen but we all have cell phones and have the number for the campground with us to let the camp host know we will be late or can’t come at all. Stiffer cancellation fees should be imposed at all sites, state, federal or private.
To me, the only other workable alternative is to make everything first come first serve. Allow no reservations.
Agree 100%.
I fully support this plan and most of the other plans suggested. I do believe there should be some flexibility for unexpected circumstances that cause you to be 1-2 days late, as long as you contact the campground or update your reservation. But therein lies the problem. From what I’ve seen, the campground reservation systems typically aren’t programmed to let you adjust your reservation (at least not easily). Canceling and creating a new reservation means cancelation fees and new booking fees. Also a lot of systems lockout changes/new reservations in the 24-48 hours prior to checkin. The booking systems need to be updated to allow/incentive campers to play nicely. Calling the campground office or camp host? Many parks don’t man the phones continuously or have no cell/landline service. Fixing this means spending money to ensure there’s a way to communicate with them and that someone is on duty–very difficult today.
Thank you for posting Jake. What you describe has happened to me on several occasions and has left me with little incentive/choice but to pay for the initial reservation even if I can’t make it.
Just had a thought on the “I paid for it so it should be mine” concept. While it definitely seems as selfish as hoarding toilet paper during COVID times, it fits in the free market economy that we are living in. And it makes me wonder what people would think about people who have a home or rent an apartment but are never home, in an area where there’s a housing shortage? (By never home, I mean gone for X months a year, whether it be or work or pleasure.) Should their home be freed up for others who need it? I realize it’s not the same thing, but where do we draw the line between “I paid for it so it’s mine, whether I use it or not” and “you aren’t using it, so someone else should be able to use it”?
Public campgrounds are priced well below what the free market would price them at. They are in scenic/highly visited spots and tend to have large sites. Compare private campgrounds nearby to the public park campgrounds to see the difference in price. If you want to scream free market, check to see if it’s a free market beforehand.
Sorry but you are being a bad egg!!
It became really blatant in our state 2 yrs ago…so time of Covid- folks newer to camping that dont understand cc etiquette…I tried booking a site in the fall few yrs ago at state park that has 2 seperate campgrounds within the park…I thought ok well EVERY ONE decided to go camping…nope 1st day we arrived only couple of campers…of course the cc with a few sites available was the least desirable of the 2.It was a long ways into park,far away from all activities.The cc we wanted to reserve in was 80% empty!!! Yes you saw that right.The next day we again drove back to that CC still 80% empty.I thought ok just a glitch in the reservation system.I asked a couple park attendants and just got a shrug of the shoulders.So then I started reading up on the situation.Folks are openly admitting to reserving up to 4 wks at various cc for different times knowing they would only be using 1 maybe 2 wks of what they reserved so they could decide later when & where they really wanted to go,and just werent concerned about canceling to allow others to have a slot!!! Probably those people that received too much stimulus money that they didnt need to begin with.Then we begin to see more and more of same patten in many of WV state parks. Unfortunately WV went to reservation only in 2019 and its been downhill every since. Folks getting into fights over the system somehow letting 2 people rent same site…Prior some sites were reservable with a majority 1st come 1st serve. It is great to have option of reservations for sure,but like others mentioned 95% have cell phones,I say more like 99.9%,I dont know anyone that doesnt carry a cell phone.So I agree if you are no show no call,release site after 24 hrs,let someoone else enjoy the site.We meet many folks that are traveling cross country,I cant imagine the frustration in stopping at a near empty cc to be told; sorry we are all booked up!As someone that had a bad experience almost 20 yrs ago I feel the frustration.After my husband and I worked hard at our jobs all week,and a break from baseball we loaded our 2 boys up & drove to our favorite campground- we called ahead to verify that there were still 1st come 1st serve sites yes at least 18 out of 88 sites. We had a small pop up so almost any site would be ok.After driving 1hr.20 minutes with 2 other campers following right behind us over half the trip,my husband being the gentleman he is pulled off the road instead of stopping right in front of the office so other’s could also park & get around…the folks behind us ran into the office and got THE LAST 2 SITES!!!! They were all together,laughing at us over the whole way to their vehicles!!! Rightly we were 1st in line so we should have had a site,they had tents they could have shared a site.I told my husband never be the nice guy in this situation!!! There was absolutely no where in the area left,so we journeyed back home with 2 very sad little boys.
At this very same cc we have seen many sites over the past 2 yrs tagged but sitting empty and its happening each time in the most popular area in the cc that can accommodate larger campers.
So Jake your attitude is whats wrong in this new world of camping,so sad.
The world could be a much better place if folks cared about doing whats right verses I am only going to do whats right for ME.
And yes your ex of owning a house makes no sense.
We stopped overnite at a cc on our way back from the Smokey Mt last summer…was happy to see this CC took the no show seriously and it was plastered on their website and at the office,their was no doubt that wasnt flying at their cc because you were going to loose your money and the site was going to be rented to another camper.It was a full campground,no empties there.I hope all CC start following.
I fully agree with this policy too, and hope other parks will follow. Yet hope too that some consistency prevails. It is simply a common civility and show of respect for others to let an expectant someone know a change in your plans, most especially when you know dozens of others are seeking what you are holding but not using, and in some cases not even intending to use. We shouldn’t have as policy allowing the practice of not showing up based on the one or two rare times one absolutely cannot make a phone call! If the overbooking of sites hadn’t been extremely overused, this may not be an issue- but this is the reality we live in. These sites are not one’s property (paid for or not!)- these are lands for all and should be shared, and used judiciously and respectfully.
I wish they would just prevent people from making multiple reservations for the same dates AND do this as well. It’s frustrating to not be able to get a site. I hope other state parks follow this same process.
Are you talking about “reservations for the same dates” at different campgrounds? How is any reservation system, automated or otherwise, going to know if you have a multiple reservation? Only the person making the reservation will know what their plans will be. If you book it and change your mind most of us will likely change of cancel a reservation if it’s reasonable to do so. However, a lot of places are adopting the adaptive pricing models based on dates and durations of stay, usually with stiff cancellation policies and fees. Most understand that if it is just as or more expensive to cancel or change a reservation then we will just leave it and not show up. The only way I see to solve the “empty site problem” is have no reservations at all (first come first served) or full refunds up to 24 hours prior, not the two weeks before or the week of partial nonsense.
My solution would be you would have to give your rv license plate and have all the recreation.gov sites red flag it if booking more than one site or park at the same time. Then make them choose one! As far as arriving late, it should be released the next day at checkout time if no one calls as to why. Then if they dont notify of being late, forfeit the whole reservation cost.
Love your idea!
I agree that if you are no-show the campground should be able to release the site to other campers. The money from the original reservation could be used to improve campsites. This pass week we noticed reserved on several campsites that were not used at a Texas State Park. All you need to do is notify the staff that you’re not coming.
State park phones, are they manned 24/7? Would a site be given away because no one was around to answer my call after 5pm on Friday because I couldn’t make it until Sunday?
Agreed. We are lucky anymore if there is even a Ranger in the ranger hut when coming into a state park.
The short view: A Steamboat Lake State Park type of policy may help in the short term with making a few more sites available with varying advance notice and depending upon how and when such sites are made available to the public, possibly on a local campground bulletin board or on a website feeding watchdog bots.
So many folks scrambling to grab a share of a limited resource; $, Baby Formula, TP, Gas, Campsites. It can get ugly.
The long view; Increasingly, the problem is mostly due to Demand exceeding Supply. Our planet has limited shrinking desirable resources on the Supply side. Demand might test that limit but ultimately it has to be the part that changes; a finite resource cannot be increased.
Change has growing/learning pains. Yesteryear it was check the Rand McNally at 4PM and pull into whatever campground was handy. Today it’s advanced reservations and dealing with tickets to even drive thru a park. What is your vision for a better Tomorrow?
It would seem to me that a cut off time should be established, ie 6PM on the given day, after which the site will be let out. Without a CC to prepay for a late arriver, that should be the end of the discussion. And without contact prior to the cutoff time, then the site is G-O-N-E gone~
About time. Follow through every campground everywhere!
Last year I had to be a couple days late for my fall camping because my mother-in-law died. They do not allow partial cancellation so I just had to arrive late.
Also, in Indiana if you book a weekend you have to book the entire weekend even if you only want part of the weekend.
Make it possible to modify reservation or book only one day and I would. Also, give a good number to call on reservation confirmation and I would.
Agreed.
Absolutely correct! There is no incentive to cancel as you get no money back! Canceling takes time and if you are not going to make it, you are dealing with other pressing problems.
I hope so. With practically everyone having a cellphone or access via a free public library computer, contacting the campground if you have problems arriving on time is not only being responsible camper’s it’s allowing others to utilize what will only be wasted space.
Agree, if you can’t call ahead (within 24 hours) to say you will be late,…sorry you may lose your site and monies. 95+% of us carry cell phones. Be courteous.
How rude not to call and cancel or tell them you are being delayed. I always do that. That is the way I was raised.
We got lucky last year @ Bahia Honda and snagged a site for a week, But half the sites were just empty, Rangers could care less, they don’t want to get involved and the state’s have pawned off the reservation system to the big corporations. They need to make the Rangers pay based on fully occupied sites and get rid off these campsite hogs..
I don’t understand why there is a question here – if you don’t show up at a hotel you get charged, then they sell your room if they can. If you show up late you might have a room or you might not! If people are now so inconsiderate that it’s this common – especially knowing that campgrounds are booking up – it is completely confusing to me that these policies wouldn’t be implemented!
Totally agree. Hold people accountable. We try to call if we are late and we try to cancel if we aren’t gong to make it. Someone may want that site! It has always been a courtesy but as usual we will have to implement a rule to get people to comply. I work in an outpatient clinic and if you don’t set rules about arrival people show up early (as in 1-2 hours) or late and expect treatment!
Absolutely! Have these people never heard of cell phones? I’ve called places and told them “I will not be arriving tonight/tomorrow you can reuse my site if needed BUT I will be there tomorrow/the day after for rest of my reservation.” Follow up with an email to them.
Ask any park ranger to name his/her degree major. Likely few are in recreation. Degrees in the environmental sciences do not necessarily prepare one for running a campground. I doubt few campers have ever read the job description of a park ranger.
Read the mission of the Forest Service: to sustain the health, diversity, and productivity of the nation’s forests and grasslands to meet the needs of present and future generations. Campgrounds are something thrust upon most districts as an additional source of revenue and are often a distraction from the overall mission.
As kids, we went to the parks to play on the river rocks, hunt wildflowers, catch a glimpse of wildlife, hike and enjoy nature. In 2022, I suspect a large portion of the day use involves water parks and swimming pools.
Personally, I think all state and national parks should turn campgrounds over to corporate managers and get back to being the caretakers of the environment as intended.
As a park manager, let me tell you the park perspective. We work for complaint driven agencies. Complaints bring parks to a grinding halt. A reactionary complaint run up the flagpole receives more attention than a compliment. There is no one angrier than a camper who arrives late , whether a few hours or the next day and you have resold their site. Now you have a angry person with no where to go. It is safer for park staff to let the paid for reserved site stay unoccupied just in case that person shows up to use it, rather than get blasted on the internet and by headquarters if the person loses their reservation. There is little local control and reservations are outsourced to a corporation. That is all.