Lithium has been touted as the “greatest thing since sliced bread” for RVs! I am always a little skeptical of the next great thing, though. When we had 990 watts of solar installed on our RV, lithium batteries were still unstable, sometimes catching fire, and couldn’t charge in the cold without elaborate heating measures.
We visited friends who are in the desert for three months without any hookups last week. They are extremely happy with their lithium batteries that keep everything in their 34-foot fifth wheel running smoothly. At least, now that they have learned not to turn on everything, including the microwave, at once.
We camped near them, and I always felt a little sheepish about having to start our loud generator to recharge our house batteries before turning in at night. Those batteries needed to keep our residential refrigerator going and not drop the batteries below half power. After seven years, their age was showing.
We moved on to Quartzsite, Arizona, to dry camp for a few days in the desert and decided to at least see what upgrading the batteries to lithium would cost. It was less than we thought: a little under $3,000 for two, 300-amp-hour Epoch batteries, the lithium battery isolation manager (BIM), and installation. Our existing Magnum inverter could be programmed, and we didn’t need any additional devices. We would replace six 100 amp hour Lifeline AGM batteries.
Johnny, one of the techs at Solar Bill RV Solar, has become a friend over the years, doing work on our RVs. My husband admits he is a dinosaur with technology, so Johnny had me download the apps to read the charging and discharging rate on the batteries. He said I was going to love it, and he was right! I was so excited to see every little thing that was pulling amps or even fractions of amps. I turned on the ceiling fan and it showed the draw! I turned on all the lights, the furnace, and even the microwave! I backed off the microwave right away…
We have never even tried the microwave or the electric coffee pot without the generator running before. He assured us we could do that now. At least separately.
We used the power with abandon, and the next morning we were only down to 79%. I watched the sun rise and the solar started to recharge the batteries again. Evidently, between 11 a.m. and 2 p.m. is happy hour for slurping up the sun’s rays in Quartzsite in early spring.
I turned on the generator and watched them recharge even faster. My husband, the guy who likes full-hookup camping best, was even satisfied that this boondocking thing was okay and not too terribly inconvenient.
Geez—we have a hundred gallons of fresh water, large black and gray holding tanks, a gas stove, water heater, furnace and now almost unlimited electricity. What is not to like?
We liked it so much, I think we may dry camp more and renew our Harvest Hosts membership to cut our six-month RVing costs. The upgrade could pay for itself in a couple of months by eliminating some high-priced RV parks.
MORE ARTICLES ABOUT LITHIUM BATTERIES:
- RV lithium battery upgrades for beginners
- Will my RV’s charger be sufficient for new lithium batteries?
- Do you need RV solar, lithium batteries, or a generator?
- Updated review after months of use: LiTime lithium batteries and accessories are a great value
- Can different type and age RV batteries be mixed? Can I add a lithium battery?
##RVT1202
Hey Nanci. What BIM (Battery Isolation Manager) did you use? I changed over to Li batteries, changed the Magnum settings on the panel and Spyder panel as well, and I cannot get it to charge up to 100%. Seems like it has 14.2V, but even with the 600W solar, the batteries (2-12v, 270A each) do not get charged, even with Gen running for 30-40 minutes, or plugged in! Any ideas anyone! The shop doesn’t fix it! Frustrating!
Not sure what batts and SOC monitor you are using. But some Epochs, maybe other brands, do not register charge current when it is small. Over days/weeks of typical discharge/charge, the internally measured SOC shown on the bluetooth app becomes steadily inaccurate (too low). So they may be charging to near 100% but not displaying correctly. One “fix” is to install an external Victron Smart Shunt and use it for a more accurate SOC reading. This is well documented on forums with Epoch 460AH batteries. One article is here. (scroll down to “SOC Inaccuracies”). I would also try bumping up to near the max recommended charge voltage on your settings and see if that makes a difference. Good luck!
Ran, you need at least one charging source that provides 14.6v, whether that’s solar, alternator, or generator.
What do you have your solar controller set to?
For alternator charging, you need a DC-DC charger. A BIM will not increase the alternator voltage (typically 14v or less) to 14.6v. A DC-DC charger will provide the necessary voltage and also limit the amperage draw on the alternator (as a BIM does), eliminating the possibility of damage due to alternator overheating.
Your generator power goes through either a converter or an inverter/charger to produce charging voltage. Whether you need to adjust it, replace it, add a lithium charging module depends on your specific system.
See my posts below
We have a Victron Energy readable on my phone through VictronConnect app.
Why are you so focused on getting to 100% with Lithium batteries? These are not lead acid batteries.
They are a game changer. We spent the first twenty years of camping with lead acid batteries. We had to replace them every few years as even just a couple of days of camping would take the battery under 50% and degrade its life. Now we have a 400ah lithium with 1000 watts of solar and it’s been fantastic for the type of camping we do.
Nancy, you briefly mentioned “…couldn’t charge in the cold without elaborate heating measures” as a PRIOR issue with lithium. I was hoping you had updated details, but didn’t see anything more in your article.
Cold weather charging and use is THE issue that holds me back from lithium. I know you know all about Minnesota cold! DW & I don’t head south to escape winter. I want batteries that can stay hooked up, charging, and ready to go year around. Is there a solution for that now? I know some lithiums have built in heat, but not sure if that technology is good for temps of -30F or colder. Not that we’re camping in that, but my motorhome shed is not heated.
Mikal, unlike FLA batteries that gas, LifePo4 do not. For that reason, you can actually install them inside your rig to keep them from seeing the cold without bringing them inside your sticks and bricks.
We run with 800 Ah lithium for our power hungry rigs and have seen no problems with either the heat of the Mojave (115F) or the frost of Eagle’s Nest (-7F). Hotter or colder than that and we put the RV in the barn hooked to an extension cord…..LOL
Living in Utah, we camp in the cold a lot. We have a 5th wheel, so the batteries are in the front compartment. They don’t need to be vented, so I surround them with insulation foam and cover with a blanket. I think the heat in the trailer also helps. So far, so good. The coldest we have camped was teens-twenties. When storing at home, I have a small electric heater I put in the front compartment that I set to 50 degrees. We used to take the batteries out and bring them in the house, but this seems to work fine. This summer, I think I’m going to insulate the walls of the front compartment and see what that does. Also, the batteries have a BMS so they won’t charge under 32 degrees.
The “self-heating” batteries are really batteries that contain the heating blanket. They ONLY heat themselves if they are PLUGGED INTO SHORE POWER. That is a critical factor to know. The batteries themselves 1) don’t have enough amps to run the heating blankets, and 2) would deplete themselves completely if they automatically started a heating pad, but had no recharging current. So, you need to have the shore power cord for your trailer plugged-in for the batteries to heat.
But, as mentioned below, if you install the batteries in the living compartment, as long as you are using your furnace, the batteries should be warm enough to charge. I camp in single-digit temps (F), no problem.
“ They ONLY heat themselves if they are PLUGGED INTO SHORE POWER.“ some, yes. Some, no. Therefore you are wrong.
Thanks for all the responses. My motorhome is not heated in winter, unless we’re using it.
What I got from all the responses is that Lithiums really haven’t had any significant advances for below freezing temperatures as insinuated in the article. Below 32°F and they aren’t charging. As in the past, keep them warm via an outside source or you won’t have power. That’s not meant to be negative statement on them, just a material fact in my consideration.
And lead acid batteries have had “significant advances?”
“ As in the past, keep them warm via an outside source or you won’t have power.” WRONG AGAIN. Power is fine at 32. Can’t charge below 32. New RV batteries automatically won’t allow charging below 32.
Nancy, the picture shows two 100AH batteries. I’m confused?
Sorry for the confusion, Sebastian. That was actually an image Dave Solberg took for one of his posts and was not put in there by Nanci. Have a good day. 😀 –Diane at RVtravel.com
So an article photo is inaccurate?
Hi, Larry. The article photo shows lithium batteries, but not Nanci’s. (I don’t know why, as I didn’t put it in.) Have a great day. 😀 –Diane
After many years of using FLA/AGM batteries, we made the move to a single 300 Ahr lithium battery. I would have installed a second but there wasn’t room in the truck camper battery compartment.
What changed for me was a 45 plus minute conversation I had with the folks at SFK battery. They answered all my questions without hesitation. Without that conversation I’d likely still be using my old heavy AGMs.
With 645 watts of solar the battery stays charged or with no sun, a short time on the Honda brings it back up. We love the lithium battery, especially when boondocking, and would never go back to anything else.
You already had the solar panels on the roof and you still paid ~ $3000 – wow.
So many cheaper ways to upgrade, I did it last year and it cost me $1575:
2 Renogy 400w Solar Panel kit (2 200 panel; top of the line solar charge controller;all wiring, connectors fuses,etc) – $737
Battery Isolation Manager – $150
Power Converter upgrade board for LIFEPo4 Batteries – $278
2 100Ah LIFEPo4 Batteries (w/Bluetooth and built in heaters) – $409
Self installed.
Basically you really overspent, even if solar bill is a buddy.
That was my thought too. $3000 and still can’t run the ac for more than an hour or two.
She’s happy with her situation. Your mileage may vary.
Steve is being polite to just say “you overspent.”
I agree, lithium batteries are the best! We boondock a lot, and like you, were always running the generator we had to lug in the truck. Our trailer had two 100AH flooded acid batteries and one 165 W solar panel. This set up could keep up with our 12V fridge for maybe 3 days, then we had to get out the generator. We now have 365W of solar panels and two 200AH lithium (400AH total) batteries and I think as long as there is sun, we could go indefinitely. Our friends that we spend two weeks in Quartzsite every year all added solar and lithium this past January while in Quartzsite. There are a lot of solar guys in Quartzsite BTW. Congrats on your new set-up, you’ll love it!
I think these newer costs will be a boon to people on the fence about solar/lithium. When we got ours installed in 2021on our 2017 34 foot Jayco 5th wheel, 4-100 amp Battle Born batteries, 1200 watts of solar x 3 panels, 3,000 watt inverter/charger, it cost us close to $13,000.00.
Best money spent! We very seldom stay at any, expensive, and they almost all are nowadays, RV parks. Dry camp/boondocking, Harvest Hosts etc., is the way we travel every time, and haven’t looked back or missed the crowds and tight spaces at most parks. We LOVE traveling with this setup. Always have power where ever we go.
$13k…lol
We have used our generator for 1 hour in 4 years while dry camping. The other 18 run-hours were for exercising the generator while parked at home. We run every electric appliance in our motorhome from 500w of solar, 2 Li batteries, and a 2kw inverter-charger. This includes the induction cooktop, conv-microwave, and 12v fridge. Since I replaced the fried AC-heat pump with a 12v evaporative cooler, we can even run it off the batteries while boondocking. It works well because we primarily RV in the Rockies in summer and the arid, low-humidity SW in fall and winter. It’s not a new technology for us because we have had only evaporative cooling in our Colorado home for 48 years!
Congratulations, Nanci! We may follow suit in a few years. Our AGM batteries are still doing okay. We have no solar and likely never will, given how rarely we boondock. Have a great day and safe travels!
RV Lithium batteries, LiFePO4, don’t catch fire and if you paid $3000 for 600 amps you know nothing about nothing.