By Cheri Sicard
Josh the RV Nerd, one of our readers’ favorite RV YouTube channels, is about to expose one of the RV industry’s biggest myths: RV dual-pane windows!
According to Josh, RV dual-pane windows are “a borderline scam”!
It’s not that they don’t have any value at all, but it’s probably not what you are expecting or have been led to believe.
To help you be a savvy RV consumer, the video covers what benefits you should and should not expect from RV dual-pane windows, along with what you can expect to get for your money when choosing this often-pricey RV upgrade.
Josh begins by explaining that these windows are often sold as RV “thermal pane” windows (sometimes cutely labeled thermo pane windows). However, the consumer needs to understand that they are NOT actually thermal-pane windows at all.
Josh says it’s difficult to tell RV dual-paned windows from ordinary frameless windows visually. You should see a sticker touting that the window is insulated; however, according to Josh, it’s not. He explains why he says that along with the technicalities of why and what the insulation ratings actually do, and do not, mean, at point 1:20 in the video below.
RV thermal windows: Not what you think
When they think of thermal or dual-paned windows, most people envision the residential variety, which is two panes of glass that is typically filled with some sort of gas to prevent the transmission of thermal heat.
That is NOT what you are typically getting with RV dual-paned windows, that are typically made of two pieces of glass bonded together without space between them.
Go to point 3:17 in the video for the technical comparison of RV dual-pane windows versus single-pane RV windows. You might be surprised that there is little to no insulation gain to these expensive RV upgrades. Josh says you can accomplish more by simply pulling your RV’s shades closed. Doing this clocks in at double the R-rating of the RV dual-pane windows!
RV windows and condensation misconceptions
At point 5:30 in the video, that condensation in an RV is just moisture looking for a place to collect. The type of windows has no bearing on the amount of condensation in your rig or where it accumulates. And not accumulating on the windows means it is accumulating somewhere else where it could possibly grow mold or mildew. Josh says a good dehumidifier is the answer, especially when cold camping.
Are there ANY advantages to RV dual-pane windows?
Josh says they do offer one significant benefit, and that is the amount of noise they keep outside of your RV. They might not insulate against the weather, but Josh says they truly do insulate against noise.
Josh suggests you go to an RV dealer lot and experience it for yourself. Go into a rig with double-bonded RV windows, then go into a single-paned rig and compare.
Are there exceptions?
Yes. A few brands make true dual-pane RV windows like you see in residential homes. But according to Josh, you are going to have to look very hard to find them. Be prepared to open your wallet, as well, as they are almost always in high-end diesel pushers and large luxury 5th wheels. If you know of exceptions, drop them in the comments.
Of all the brands he works with, Josh does not see any of them making a true dual-pane window.
“Euro-style” RV windows are the other exception, as they are true dual-pane windows with inside and outside layers with an air break in between. When he shot the video, Josh said there was no reliable R-value information on these. However, he did find some references that you can locate at point 9:50 in the video.
He also says that the insulative properties of the Euro-style windows are another factor you can go out and test for yourself on a hot day at an RV dealership.
Be sure to watch until the end of the video for Josh’s tips on what to do instead of paying for expensive RV dual-pane windows. You’ll get better insulation and save a bundle of bucks!
##RVT1180
I’ve been rving 30+ years & had many rvs, with single pane windows, until we went fulltime 15 years ago, & then double pane, with space between them, but no gas, for the last 15 years in a New Horizons 5th wheel & now a Host triple slide truck camper. The T/C actually has solar dual pane glass. I agree with your condensation comments, which can be managed by cracking a window or vent, without adding a dehumidifier, & I agree about the sound difference. I do, however, think our 5er dual panes have a little more insulating effect than you claim, & our T/C with the solar dual glass definitely has more benefit.
Also comes down to wall thickness. Industry standard is a 1-1/4” to a 1.5” exterior wall. We have a 2” wall plus you’d so called thermal pane windows in our Outdoors RV unit. Also the roof has a double truss system with a full 5” of insulation wall top to wall top. Huge huge difference from our last two Aerolite units. Both in cold and hot climates. Their Thermal Pane’s standard on ORV brand of trailers. Having the 2” walls on “every” wall is a game changer including side outs. Was boondocking in 90-95 temps on a Tennessee summer trip in full sun and the single AC only ran 50% of the time.
Yep, a few quality manufacturers just build differently. Newmar still builds walls with 16″ OC studs (aluminum), batt insulations, vapor barrier, an extra 5l8″ layer of foam insulation, thick floors and ceilings, no laminated walls to delaminate, thick fiberglass hung walls, etc. Yes, they cost more.
We certainly like ours, Mikal. Safe travels!
Agreed about Outdoors RV…they are built more like the old Hitchhikers were.
I notice a difference with condensation on my Outdoors RV and the Jayco Jayflight TT. On the Jayco they always got condensation on the windows. When you wiped them it didn’t do much good. On the outdoors RV if you close the curtains at night or cook on the stove top you’ll get some condensation. If you wipe them afterwards, they won’t recondensate like the Jayco did.
We had our single pane windows replaced with dual pane HEHR windows at the factory (Northwood). This was on our 2012 25Y Arctic Fox (in 2013). We paid for the windows. They installed them at no cost. The biggest advantage was getting huge slider windows replacing the smaller crank out original windows. My guess is that this ‘transaction’ could not happen now.
Probably not as they have trimmed out some perks since Covid.
“…it’s probably not what you are expecting or have been led to believe.”
Just like most of the rest of what the RV mfg industry does!
Having used the tin foil bubble sheets for years on windows,even in a house, I can attest the stuff works quite well at keeping out heat. But…in winter you will still get some condensation behind the stuff that must be wiped up to prevent any mold or mildew from forming. It’s not rocket science…it’s called ingenuity. Dehumidifiers work OK but…if you are off grid you still need a source of power to run them.
Not meaning to argue but our Outdoors RV 24RKS has true dual pane windows. We camp in the snow every year and notice much less condensation and considerable better insulation as well as noise reduction. Our big window lost its seal and became cloudy so we had it replaced. We are very pleased with Outdoors RV!
Have had two Bigfoot 25′ trailers with true double pane windows.
In between those two we had an Escape camper with awning double glass windows. Huge difference. In cold weather cold air would wash down the Escape windows, so you had to move to a warmer area in the camper.
Bigfoot windows have gas between the glass and are tinted to activate when sun hits the glass. While we enjoyed the Escape, there is a huge difference in heat retention/air gaps, with the Bigfoot far superior in cold weather
Both trailers are manufactured in Canada where they take these campers to ski areas camping over the weekends. Both campers are made properly and had zero manufacturing problems.
My Phoenix Cruiser motorhome has Hehr double pane windows with about 1/2 inch air between the panes. They are very quiet, well insulating and never sweat in winter. I wish I could have a windshield like them.
A disadvantage of dual pane, it adds weight without any benefit
Our first MH (1985 Winnie Chieftain) had single-pane windows. Lots of condensation. Our second MH (2000 Itasca Suncruiser) had double-paned windows, 7 of which leaked and were replaced). Our third and final MH (2016 Itasca Suncruiser) had double-paned windows none of which leaked. Given a choice we would choose double-paned windows again.
Our 2019 Solitude has dual pane with an airgap between the panes. However several of them have had condensation between the panes so they are not exactly sealed. Another couple, while showing no signs of condensation, are showing signs of fogging between the panes. These are Lippert made units. Our previous trailer, a Carriage Cameo also had dual pane and virtually all of them had fogged badly. Those were Hehr before Lippert bought them out.
We use those plastic window kits. The kind to put double stick tape on the frame and then stick the plastic and heat with a hair dryer. They stop almost all condensation on the glass and the plastic stays nice and clear. We use the roof vents and small circulating fans to help control humidity in cabinets and the closet.
Tbank you, Cheri! RV #2 has dual-pane windows, I think. Now that I have read this, I will check our RV. I will let you know tomorrow. Have a great day and safe travels!
I don’t mean to complain but… I don’t understand the logic behind an article in RVTravel that describes a video I could watch on YouTube. I prefer reading over streaming video, so if the goal is to educate me on a topic, I’ll gladly read it. But if the goal is to simply describe a video I could watch for myself…. Well, I don’t understand why the effort was even made.